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Who has had to replace a PCM

 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04 Oct 2012, 09:35 am
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Default Who has had to replace a PCM

I was wondering how many folks had to replace a bad PCM, if so what kind of model, ie turbo, non turbo, turbo light ,auto vs stick, and how many miles on the car when you repalced it.

Bear with me here:

about a month ago my 05 GT stick Conv with 20K miles started to have an issue. The chime would come on, check engine light for a second or two, sometimes it would not impact anything other times car would die and stall. Would start right back up with no stored codes. Note I had gone through it in the spring when I bough the car tuned up with new MP wires, Champ plugs, cleaned TB, new battery, clean grounds etc and ran great for next 7000 miles.

Once it hiccuped for the first time a month ago, I threw a cam sensor at it and it still did it. Bit the bullet, brought to dealer since I have a couple friends who are techs. They looked and found nothing with the DRB III. So we copiloted it. This is older and unsupported now from Chrysler. They set up the copilot(hooks up to the port) to monitor certain fucntions with their old system, he loaded about 10 things to monitor. You drive around and when it hiccups you press the button on it and it saves the things in memory, about 45 seconds prior and 15 seconds after. They download the info into the old system(a PC connected to their older software) and try to figure out what is going on.

So I drove for 3 days car finally hiccuped, hit the button, car basically no power, CEL light on and I pulled over. Turned ignition out of run position and tried to start it, it just cranked, did this twice. SO I figured good car is dead. So turned key to "off" position and tried to start and it fired right back up. So bring it back to dealer. They cant get the data out of the Copilot. Remember I mention Chrysler doesnt support this anymore.

So he loans me his DRB III to use, basically to do same thing. DRBIII is standalone so no issues and is still fully supported.

This time when it happens/hiccups I hit a "record" button on the DRBIII Box, it came up, Lost Communication"

SO I was having a bus issue, so the PCM is not recording anything (Hence no codes) since the bus is going down, nothing to see. Since it is intermittent, probably not a connector or wiring issue. So now I research and any of the damn modules can have a problem and take down the stupid bus.

What modules do we have with communication on the bus: Instrument Cluster(Contains Body Control Module), PCM, SKIM( Sentry Key Imobilizer) RKE (Remote Keyless Entry), OCR (Air bag module) ABC (Antilock brake), Radio

So now your stuck guessing.

I had an issue with my Instrument Cluster back in July dieing, (had to reset via battery) so I agreed to replace that. That didnt do it. Still had issue, So we tried the PCM and so far so good. When it was acting up, it would happen every 40 -60 miles give or take. I have gone 500 with the new PCM and no issues.


So long story short, if you are getting problems and no codes I would suspect the PCM. Note the dealer nor anyone else can troubleshoot these intermittent problems. Makes me wonder as the OEM's put more junk into the cars, when they age what wonderful problems people will have when the car is 10-15 years old?? Note they cut me a deal on the Mic and PCM, but both were over 450$ each plus diagnostic time so this was quite expensive.
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03 PT GT Black 5 sp Stg 1 sold
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04 Oct 2012, 10:24 am
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Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

first off.. as far as a new PCM goes, personally i wouldnt buy new (unless it was aftermarket for more power) you can purchase a reman PCM for right around $150ish

and as far as the old PCM being bad. it's very well possible i've seen brand new (right outta the box) be faulty. and personally i've ordered a reman that wasnt right either. its all a "crap-shoot"

anything is possible congrats on getting it straightened out tho, & keep us posted if you have further issues!
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Old 04 Oct 2012, 10:31 am
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Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

I think all the units are now re-furbished, Chrysler takes the old one back or you pay core charge.

What I learned from this is to probably buy a spare PCm, drive it a bit and put it on the shelf.

It seems hit or miss aftermarket(from doing a search) so I opted for the Chrysler PCM, note they have to program some things into it with the DRBIII, so not sure what you get from any of the aftermarket units.

Sad part is my older cars, I have spare SMECs and logic moduels but the newer stuff is different animal.
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86 TurboZ CS 2.2 T2 +20's A555
00 Durango SLT+ 5.9 4x4
02 Grand Cherokee 4.7 4x4
03 PT GT Black 5 sp Stg 1 sold
05 PT GT Silver 5 Spd Conv
06 PT GT Cool Vanilla 5 spd Conv
06 PT Base Marine Blue 40TE Conv
15 Grand Cherokee Overland 5.7 QD2
17 Challenger SRT A8 GoMango
18 JL Wrangler Sahara Punkn
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Last edited by VNT; 04 Oct 2012 at 10:33 am.
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Old 04 Oct 2012, 01:09 pm
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Conroe TX
Posts: 37
Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

This is alot of info to take in but i did a search in "intermittent starting" all the items below are "confirmed fixes" for intermittent starting so you your judgement




1. Vehicle was towed in for a no start condition. The vehicle will not crank or start....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check the codes in the Powertrain Control Module (PCM). 2. If there is a P0513, check the codes in the Sentry Key Remote Entry Module (Skreem), Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM) or Wireless ...

26 Confirmed fixes

Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
Sentry Key Immobilizer System (SKIM) Key


9 - Sentry Key Immobilizer (SKIM) Key
3 - Ignition Lock Cylinder Housing
2 - Fuse #33
2 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Ignition Lock Cylinder Housing, Ignition Switch
1 - Keyless Entry
1 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM), Sentry Key Immobilizer (SKIM) Key
1 - Ignition Key(s), Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM), Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Ignition Switch
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Ignition Lock Cylinder
1 - Battery Disconnect/Reconnect
1 - Ignition Lock Cylinder, Ignition Switch




2. The engine will not crank. No trouble codes in the module....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check for voltage at terminal 86 of the starter relay, with the key in the start position. Has power to terminal 86 at the starter relay. Check for ground on terminal 85 of the starter relay. Pin ...

21 Confirmed fixes

Ignition Switch
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Transmission Range (TR) Sensor
Wiring


4 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
3 - Automatic Transaxle Gearshift Cable
3 - Ignition Switch Linkage Rod
2 - Battery Cables
1 - Add-On Alarm System, Ignition Switch
1 - Ignition Switch, Ignition Switch Linkage Rod
1 - Automatic Shut Down (ASD) Relay Fuse
1 - Wiring Harness
1 - Sentry Key Immobilizer (SKIM) Key
1 - Ignition Switch Wiring
1 - Transmission Range (TR) Sensor Connector
1 - Ignition Switch Tumbler Assembly
1 - Integrated Power Module (IPM) Wiring



3. No start. The Powertrain Control Module (PCM) will not ground the Automatic Shut-Down Relay (ASD) relay. Code P0688 is stored....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Ground the control wire from the ASD relay at the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) connector. Also try test the ASD relay operation with the ATM tests found in a compatible scan tool. 2. If the...

17 Confirmed fixes

Automatic Shutdown (ASD) Relay
Automatic Shutdown (ASD) Relay Wiring
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)


8 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
2 - Fuse #19
1 - Fuse #32
1 - Totally Integrated Power Module (TIPM)
1 - Fuse #18, Fuse Box Terminals
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor Connector, Ignition Coil Assembly Connector
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
1 - Automatic Shutdown (ASD) Relay
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Wiring



4. Just replaced the cylinder head. Cranks over no start. Have no 5 volts at the Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor. Do not even have the Orange wire at the CMP....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check the CMP sensor and the ignition coil connectors. It is possible to plug in the wrong connector into each of these components. The connectors are the same style and configuration. Swap the co...

12 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector
Ignition Coil Connector


10 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector, Ignition Coil Connector
2 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector
5. No start, no crank. Found a code U0168 in the Powertrain Control Module (PCM)....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check the powers and grounds at the SKREEM. 2. Pin 3 is a Pink/White wire and should be ignition run start. Pin 5 is a Red wire, direct battery feed from the IOD fuse, pin 4 is a Black wire...

11 Confirmed fixes

Reboot
Sentry Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM) Wiring


5 - Battery Disconnect/Reconnect

2 - Fuse #33
1 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Battery Disconnect Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Reboot
1 - Battery Disconnect/Reconnect, Wireless Control Module (WCM)
1 - Wireless Control Module (WCM)


6. Engine runs like it has a lowered rev limiter. Engine will not run above 2500 RPM. Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor and Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor signals are not in sync according to the scan to...
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Scope the CMP and CKP sensors. Compare to a known good pattern. If not good, check for a bad sensor or defective target magnet for the CMP sensor. 2. Check for a loose or jumped timing belt....

6 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Target Magnet
Jumped Timing Belt


1 - Camshaft Timing
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Timing Belt
1 - Crankshaft Position Sensor And Camshaft Position Sensor Synchronization
1 - Camshaft Target Magnet


7. The engine will not crank. No trouble codes in the module....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check for voltage at terminal 86 of the starter relay, with the key in the start position. Has power to terminal 86 at the starter relay. Check for ground on terminal 85 of the starter relay. Pin ...

4 Confirmed fixes

Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
Transmission Range (TR) Sensor
Wiring Harness


1 - Ignition Switch
1 - Transmission Range (TR) Sensor
1 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Automatic Transaxle Gearshift Cable
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04 Oct 2012, 01:09 pm
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Conroe TX
Posts: 37
Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

8. No start, the Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor and Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor signals are losing sync on the scan tool....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Use a lab scope to check the CKP and CMP signals and see if they are in sync, using a known good pattern for comparison....

2 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Dowel Pin
Timing Belt


1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Timing Belt
9. It will not start. Scanner has no serial data, the OBDII says no communication....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Unplug the sensors one at a time to see if the voltage returns to 5 volts. 2. If the voltage doesn’t return, go to the C2 connector pin 29 and go out 1 to 4 inches where it's easy to repair ...

2 Confirmed fixes

Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Shorted Sensor
Wiring


1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector
10. Diagnosing no start problem. No spark....
2006 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. When diagnosing a no start problem, use the ignition switch to crank the engine. Do not use a remote starter switch. 2. The Cabin Compartment Node (CCN) (or instrument cluster) gets an input fr...

1 Confirmed fix

Tech Tip


1 - Tech Tip
- Confirmed Fix - Exact Vehicle Match
- Confirmed Fix - Similar Vehicle Match

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< Previous 10 | Next 10 > Results: 1 - 10 of 17 Show All

Hotline Archives for Same Engine Package +/- 2yrs : Hotline Fixes
Description Potential Causes
Confirmed Fix
1. Has a no crank condition and a code P0513 for invalid Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM) key....
2005 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B, USA/Canada *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Make sure the VIN is programmed in the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) and try another key from the customer....

38 Confirmed fixes

Incorrect Key
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Programming — VIN not programmed into PCM.
Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)


18 - Sentry Key Immobilizer (SKIM) Key
5 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
4 - Ignition Key(s)
2 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
2 - Engine To Transmission Ground
1 - Ignition Key(s), Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM)
1 - Security Key Remote Electronic Entry Module (SKREEM) Wiring
1 - Keyless Entry Key Fob, Wireless Ignition Node (WIN)
1 - Fob With Integrated Key (FOBIK)
1 - Ignition Key Learning Procedure, Ignition Key(s)
1 - Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM), Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM) Programming
1 - Key Fob Battery
2. Cranks no start. Has spark and fuel pressure. Code P0340 stored....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check the Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor for 5 volts on the Orange wire. 2. Check for 5 volts on the Tan/Yellow wire with it unplugged from the sensor. 3. Jumper the Tan/Yellow wire to t...

31 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position Sensor (CMP)
Broken Timing Belt


18 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
11 - Timing Belt
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Magnet
1 - Spark Plug(s), Timing Belt
3. No start, no spark or injector pulse....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Verify the injectors will all work when in the Actuator Test Mode (ATM) with the scan tool. 2. Verify the timing belt is in time, repair as needed. 3. Check for damage to the camshaft ...

28 Confirmed fixes

Cam Angle (CMP) Sensor
Crank Angle Sensor (CKP)
Timing Belt


6 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor Wiring
5 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
4 - Timing Belt
2 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
2 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
2 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Wiring
2 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector, Ignition Coil Connector
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor, Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Camshaft Timing, Timing Belt Tensioner
1 - Engine
1 - Timing Belt, Timing Belt Tensioner
1 - Automatic Shutdown (ASD) Relay
4. No spark on one coil. Tried a new coil. Dead miss on cylinders #1 and #4....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin 8, Turbo *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Monitor the Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor and the Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor on a lab scope and compare to a normal pattern. Any problem with either sensor will result in a misfire. 2. ...

12 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Ignition Coil Pack
Ignition Coil Pack Wiring
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Jumped Timing Belt


3 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
2 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
2 - Ignition Coil Pack(s)
1 - Ignition Coil Pack(s), Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Ignition Coil Pack Wiring
1 - Camshaft Gear Key, Timing Belt, Valve Job
1 - Camshaft Timing
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
5. Engine will not run above 2500 RPM. Engine runs like it has a lowered rev limiter. Code P0340 and/or P1391 stored. Have tried new Camshaft Position (CMP) and Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensors....
2005 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B, USA/Canada *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. There is no test for this. Replace the target magnet on the end of the camshaft....

12 Confirmed fixes

Target Magnet


6 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
3 - Camshaft Target Magnet
2 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor, Camshaft Target Magnet
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor, Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
6. No spark on one coil. Tried a new coil....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Unplug the connector from the coil pack. 2. Connect a test light to B+. 3. Probe the outer two wires one a time while cranking the engine. Each should flash the test light while cranking. ...

10 Confirmed fixes

Coil Pack
Wiring


6 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
2 - Ignition Coil Pack(s), Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Coil Pack Connector
1 - Ignition Coil Pack(s)
7. Engine starts and dies, then goes into a no crank condition....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Make sure the gray colored key being used on this vehicle, that is a security system key. 2. Try locking the doors with the power locks and closing the doors. Unlock using the key fob of the ...

9 Confirmed fixes

Incorrect Key
SKIM Fault Code


3 - Battery Disconnect/Reconnect
2 - Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM)
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM), Sentry Key Immobilizer Module (SKIM)
1 - Sentry Key Immobilizer (SKIM) Key
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Ignition Key(s)
8. Replaced the motor for a hole in the block, now it's a no start. Set codes P0106, P0121, P0335 and P0340....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Check the 5 volt power supply Orange wire at the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) on pin #29 of the C2 connector, a constant 5 volt should be seen here. If the voltage is low unplug the Manifold Ab...

7 Confirmed fixes

Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) Sensor
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
Throttle Position Sensor (TPS)
Wiring Harness


4 - Throttle Position Sensor (TPS)
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Connector
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
9. No spark on the 1/4 coil, setting trouble code P2302....
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin 8, Turbo *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Monitor the Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor and the Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor on a lab scope and compare to a normal pattern. Any problem with either sensor will result in a misfire. 2....

7 Confirmed fixes

Cam Angle (CMP) Sensor
Crank Angle Sensor (CKP)
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)


5 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
1 - Ignition Coil Assembly
1 - Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Wiring
10. Engine cranks and is a no start. Has a P0335 code....
2005 Chrysler PT Cruiser 2.4L, Vin B, USA/Canada *
Test Details... Confirmed Fix Details...

Tests/Procedures: 1. Test the output from the Crankshaft Position Sensor (CKP) and the Camshaft Position Sensor (CMP). Both should be 5 volt square wave signals. The CKP is located behind the timing belt cover. The CM...

6 Confirmed fixes

Cam Angle (CMP) Sensor
Crank Angle Sensor (CKP)
Damaged Sensor Blade
Valve Timing


1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor Harness
1 - Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor, Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor Wiring
1 - Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor Connector
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04 Oct 2012, 01:35 pm
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VNT VNT is offline
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Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

MSmoorenburg

did you have an issue and replace your PCM, what you posted looks like a flow chart for trouble shooting.

Note the 01-05 have PCI bus and 06-10 have Can bus.
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02 Grand Cherokee 4.7 4x4
03 PT GT Black 5 sp Stg 1 sold
05 PT GT Silver 5 Spd Conv
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Old 04 Oct 2012, 01:38 pm
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Location: Conroe TX
Posts: 37
Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

Quote:
Originally Posted by VNT View Post
MSmoorenburg

did you have an issue and replace your PCM, what you posted looks like a flow chart for trouble shooting.

Note the 01-05 have PCI bus and 06-10 have Can bus.
Not on my PT but yes in a 91 jeep cherokee. The troubleshooting flow chats did assist in finding my issue. The issue stated on my was no "check engine light" during the light check

Last edited by msmoorenburg; 04 Oct 2012 at 01:42 pm.
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Old 26 Jan 2013, 01:29 pm
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Posts: 16
Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

My 01 PT 2.0 auto have a P0601 so I ordered an OEM PCM.
First one came but engine not start. P0601 gone but P1945 come on. I talk with the oem pcm company and they are willing to give me a replacment. I am now in waiting for the transit and hope the new one will solve the problem.
At the meantime, I been talk with a few good guys. I heard it may be the Immobilizer since the key may need a code to program too as I got a grey key. I read the manual, it stated if a non programm key put in the car will start but shut down in 2-3 sec. so I hope this is not the cause, as my situation is not even start with the oem pcm..
Anyone have any experience like my could share with solution?
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Old 14 May 2016, 11:20 am
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Thumbs down Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

msmoorenburg you have this Issue listed at #2 but does not have the complete details of testing and i searched but cannot find it. I have a 2001 PT Limited with this issue. It is getting a NO BUS message and no codes and the scan tool says Not Support whne trying to read the VIN from the PCM. I am trying to find the wiring diagram for this to try to trace a possible wiring issue.
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Old 12 Jun 2017, 10:28 am
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Posts: 5
Default Re: Who has had to replace a PCM

Hello,
I have a 2004 PT cruiser non turbo, I need to replace the ECM. My question is, if I find a used one, will I still have to reprogram it? Or can I match up the same year with the type and model and plug it in? Any information would be useful.

Thank you.
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