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Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10 Jan 2013, 06:56 pm
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 2
Default Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

Hi all!

Just joined this forum... lots of great info here.

Based on reading previous threads, think I may have this problem narrowed down to the PCM, but wanted to run this by everyone to make sure that I'm not overlooking anything.

My wife has a 2005 PT Cruiser Touring Edition, L4 2.4L DOHC (non-turbo), AT, 52689 miles. Pretty much stock other than an after-market remote start (Viper) that was installed about 4 years ago.

Replaced the spark plugs (original Champion 443/RE16MC) with Champion 7570 double platinums and the plug wires (AutoZone Duralast) during the summer at about 50k miles.

Have not done any other work on the car recently and, other than a periodic rough idle (need to try cleaning the IAC valve), have not had any issues with the car.

The other day, when my wife tried to start the car, it cranked but would not start. Actron CP9145 scanner and key dance yielded no DTCs.

First checked the ignition coil and there was NO spark to any of the plugs. Removed the ignition coil... no obvious external damage and bench test showed both primaries at 0.50 ohms and both secondaries at 12.8K ohms (within spec). Re-installed the ignition coil and verified the ASD relay was activated and providing battery voltage to the primary coil input (pin 2 on ignition coil connector). However, it appears that the PCM is not providing the ground connection (on either pin 1 or pin 3) to complete the primary circuit and energize the coil. Verified wiring continuity from the ignition coil to the PCM coil control (pins 9 & 10 on the orange PCM connector).

Seems to be an issue with the coil control circuitry in the PCM, but not sure if I'm missing something else which could cause these symptoms.

Have not checked the cam or crank position sensors yet, though guessing that if they were bad, I would either see the appropriate DTC and/or the PCM would de-activate the ASD relay, removing power from the coil primaries.

Assuming that I'm on the right track, looking for any feedback/recommendations/experiences with reman vs. new PCMs.

Not sure if anything in particular could cause the PCM coil control circuitry to fail, but would also appreciate any suggestions on things to check before I install the reman/new one... esp. if this Cruiser has suddenly developed a habit of eating PCMs for lunch...

Thanks!

Dave
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11 Jan 2013, 10:33 am
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Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

Dave,

Sorry nobody has responded to your post. We usually have several knowledgeable people ready and willing to help. As you said, with no fault codes to go by, that would rule out the individual parts like the sensors and lead to thinking that it's the computer (PCM). Maybe by my responding to your post, others will now see there's an active thread and come up with a solution or a way to go to find the problem.
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Old 11 Jan 2013, 10:39 am
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Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

I would suspect the remote start - try and rule that out.
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Old 11 Jan 2013, 11:09 am
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Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

I would tend to agree with the PCM diagnosis, but you need to be certain that your remote start isn't malfunctioning and causing the problem.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11 Jan 2013, 02:18 pm
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Join Date: Dec 2012
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Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

Thanks all for the feedback!

Will try to remove the remote start... without messing up anything else in the process...

Thanks!

Dave
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 14 Jun 2013, 09:45 pm
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1
Question Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dxv77 View Post
Hi all!

Just joined this forum... lots of great info here.

Based on reading previous threads, think I may have this problem narrowed down to the PCM, but wanted to run this by everyone to make sure that I'm not overlooking anything.

My wife has a 2005 PT Cruiser Touring Edition, L4 2.4L DOHC (non-turbo), AT, 52689 miles. Pretty much stock other than an after-market remote start (Viper) that was installed about 4 years ago.

Replaced the spark plugs (original Champion 443/RE16MC) with Champion 7570 double platinums and the plug wires (AutoZone Duralast) during the summer at about 50k miles.

Have not done any other work on the car recently and, other than a periodic rough idle (need to try cleaning the IAC valve), have not had any issues with the car.

The other day, when my wife tried to start the car, it cranked but would not start. Actron CP9145 scanner and key dance yielded no DTCs.

First checked the ignition coil and there was NO spark to any of the plugs. Removed the ignition coil... no obvious external damage and bench test showed both primaries at 0.50 ohms and both secondaries at 12.8K ohms (within spec). Re-installed the ignition coil and verified the ASD relay was activated and providing battery voltage to the primary coil input (pin 2 on ignition coil connector). However, it appears that the PCM is not providing the ground connection (on either pin 1 or pin 3) to complete the primary circuit and energize the coil. Verified wiring continuity from the ignition coil to the PCM coil control (pins 9 & 10 on the orange PCM connector).

Seems to be an issue with the coil control circuitry in the PCM, but not sure if I'm missing something else which could cause these symptoms.

Have not checked the cam or crank position sensors yet, though guessing that if they were bad, I would either see the appropriate DTC and/or the PCM would de-activate the ASD relay, removing power from the coil primaries.

Assuming that I'm on the right track, looking for any feedback/recommendations/experiences with reman vs. new PCMs.

Not sure if anything in particular could cause the PCM coil control circuitry to fail, but would also appreciate any suggestions on things to check before I install the reman/new one... esp. if this Cruiser has suddenly developed a habit of eating PCMs for lunch...

Thanks!

Dave

I also am having a similar issue, cranks but I'm not getting spark. I too found no voltage to the coil pack, and suspected a PCM. I would also appreciate feedback on the new vs. used PCM and where you might find a used one? Is there any other factors to rule out beside wiring? Thanks for your help.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 15 Jun 2013, 03:46 am
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,266
Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

ptBro; If you are not getting voltage at all, you have a different problem.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 24 May 2015, 04:01 pm
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Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1
Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

I am new to the site and PT mine starts sometimes then it does not crank or start.
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Old 24 May 2015, 05:24 pm
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Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 6
Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

I am REALLY sorry for jumping in this thread for what may not be a similar issue. I cannot find where to make a new post and all of my searches keep returning non-similar problems. Our 2006 PT Cruiser TE just died suddenly. Well, what exactly happened is, the AC died, the engine shuttered, the dash dimmed and then it read "NO BUS" on the dash. We managed to get the button for the shift stick to go down and get it into neutral so that we could push it into the lot. When getting out of the vehicle it says the lights are on but they aren't and it continues to ding when the door opens. Our friend tried using his diagnostic tool on it but it couldn't scan for any codes so that's why I am suspecting it's the PCM. We are going to tow it to a mechanic but with it being Sunday and then Memorial Day tomorrow, this is quite stressful. Should I just get it straight to the dealership or would a mechanic be fine? I do have a mechanic that can clear Chrysler codes in case it's something that simple. (That's a completely different story lol)
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Old 24 May 2015, 06:30 pm
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
Posts: 7,472
Default Re: Cranks, won't start (bad PCM ???)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DauntlessDS View Post
I am REALLY sorry for jumping in this thread for what may not be a similar issue. I cannot find where to make a new post and all of my searches keep returning non-similar problems. Our 2006 PT Cruiser TE just died suddenly. Well, what exactly happened is, the AC died, the engine shuttered, the dash dimmed and then it read "NO BUS" on the dash. We managed to get the button for the shift stick to go down and get it into neutral so that we could push it into the lot. When getting out of the vehicle it says the lights are on but they aren't and it continues to ding when the door opens. Our friend tried using his diagnostic tool on it but it couldn't scan for any codes so that's why I am suspecting it's the PCM. We are going to tow it to a mechanic but with it being Sunday and then Memorial Day tomorrow, this is quite stressful. Should I just get it straight to the dealership or would a mechanic be fine? I do have a mechanic that can clear Chrysler codes in case it's something that simple. (That's a completely different story lol)
"no bus" means that your instrument cluster is not communicating with the PCM.

I would suggest checking the battery and the battery cables. If the voltage drops to a certain level the modules start to shut down. Have a battery load test done if you are not positive the battery is good.

The 2006 and 2007 PT Cruisers are popular for having problems with the electronic modules communicating and its not easy to fix.

If you have not introduced yourself please tell us about yourself and your PT Cruiser to the forum.

Last edited by ptcruisersteve; 24 May 2015 at 06:35 pm.
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