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Locking brakes

 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2013, 07:58 am
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 43
Default Locking brakes

Hi all been very busy at work of late so not been reading the forum much.
But as I have been having trouble with the PT brakes its been parked up quite a lot.
Some may remember I asked for information before.
I have had a problem with the front brakes.
So far I have replace the flexi hoses, callipers, master cylinder and anti lock pump this morning.
I have struggled to get the right pump for the type of plug fitted.
So I did swop the plastic bottom section with the wired plug.
I have swopped the aluminium pressure block with the pump on top.
But the problem is still the same after you have been driving for three to five miles and used the brakes a dozen times you can feel the front brakes starting to hold on one side.
But it can be the off side or the near side there is no patten to it.
And its that hot you are unable to touch the wheel.
I know it sound daft but I can't keep spending money on it.
Has any body got any ideas as I don't want to scrap it.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2013, 08:21 am
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Mooresville, NC
Posts: 5,324
Default Re: Locking brakes

It's impossible to guess what the problem can be simply because there are so many things that can go wrong to cause this.

Number one item would be that the brake fluid is "infected", meaning that (a) it's possible there is dirt of some type in the lines or the cylinders, or (b) two different types of brake fluid do not mix, or (c) air in the system.

Sometimes it requires you to empty the entire brake fluid system - as in bleeding all lines clean, then add in new/clean brake fluid. If you are certain the system has not had two different types of brake fluid added, then I would highly suggest using a pump type pneumatic brake fluid bleeder. Here's a picture of a good one:



This type is not that expensive, and better than the tiny one that you see at most auto parts stores, however it does require an air compressor, even a cheap one will work. This truly sucks - and while it sounds funny, what it can do is pull any air bubbles and any other 'nastiness' from your brake lines.

So doing a complete brake bleeding can help, and with this type if you're just seeing bubbles you can re-use the fluid that is captured in the bleeder container.

The other item to look for is to trace the brake line and look for any kinks, unusual bends, dents or damage. With a damaged brake line, sometimes when you press on the pedal it won't allow the fluid pressure on a specific cylinder to 'pull back', and causes your brakes to press on the rotor and heat up badly.

These are the two most often seen problems. I know you say you've already been through this, but, in my opinion, one of these two issues is most likely the cause, and me personally, I bet it's either air or goobers in the lines, or improper fluid mix causing your problems.
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Old 06 May 2013, 10:51 am
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 43
Default Re: Locking brakes

Thanks chromenut
As I have had so much trouble with the brake system.
The first thing I did was rebleed the complete system.
I removed each calliper and retracted each of the pistons then bleed with a G clamp in place then allowed the fluid to force the piston out.
Then retracted the piston again to refit the calliper with the pads and rebleed to make sure there was very little old fluid in the system.
Then two flexi hoses rebleed again.
Then two calliper s on the front then rebleed again.
Then master cylinder rebleed the whole system again.
Then this morning ABS pump and block rebleed the whole system again.
When I have worked on the brakes I have always made sure when undoing a union that the rigid line is not spinning.
And I always use the the same supplier of fluid and dot 4 specification.
I have never had any problems bleeding the brakes and the fluid flows freely clean and without air.
As its not always the same front calliper it swops from side to side.
Is there some way of checking the ABS pump.
I can't think it would anything else.
I have never had so much problem with a braking system.
Thank
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2013, 12:05 pm
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Mooresville, NC
Posts: 5,324
Default Re: Locking brakes

Wow, you did what I would have done. Hmmm... So you've replaced the calipers? Man oh man, I don't have a lot of ideas for you then.

What year and model is your PT? I'm going to pull up all the OEM service manuals and look, I believe they'll have a section on troubleshooting the brakes but not sure. If I can find it I'll share it with you.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 06 May 2013, 12:30 pm
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 43
Default Re: Locking brakes

Thanks Chromenut
I must admit I have worked on most of my own cars as they are not normally my main mode of transport.
But with this employer I have opted out of personal use of the company vehicle.
While walking is not a bad thing as I did put some wight on while of work :-)
The fuel economy is diabolical with the brakes.
It's a pain waiting for the wife's car if I need to go some distance.
The car is a 2000/2001 with 84000 on the clock I have the old MOT to verify the mileage and the car shows very little wear.
So it seems a shame to scrap it for the brake problem.
It must be some thing simple that I'm missing.
Although I have not worked on a car with ABS? but its only a pump in line with each of the calliper.
Thanks
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07 May 2013, 03:00 am
Senior Cruiser
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,266
Default Re: Locking brakes

Ceptor; Jack up the front when cold and feel for dragging of each tire. If ok, then hit the brake pedal several times, and retest tire dragging. If ok, take it for a normal ride till they start dragging, jack up front end, add jackstands, open each bleeder screw. If they still drag it's the caliper. If they don't, you probably have air in the system.

Chrysler recommended bleeding: left rear first; then right front; right rear; left front. For the ABS bleeding, get help.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07 May 2013, 02:00 pm
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 43
Default Re: Locking brakes

Hi PT06
I find it hard to beleave at all four front calliper s could be faulty.
When thay jam on its never both its only one but on pattern to it.
As for air I did run another two pints when bleeding and it did run clear.
The brakes work fine before the problem a dozen or so operations.
And the pedal feels ferm and not spongy.
Air in the system it's posable but would have though not.
When you say air do you mean in the calliper expanding when warm then more as it gets warmer.
When you say start with rear left is that left when sat in the car or looking at the front.
As mine is a right hand drive.
As I'm sure I am not the first to work on the car.
What is the conextion order of the brake lines this may be the problem.
Do you know if the car have a rear brake compensator with ABS.
Thanks
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 08 May 2013, 01:50 am
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,266
Default Re: Locking brakes

Ceptor; Left is drivers side, right is passenger side.

If all 4 calipers are hanging up at different times, it is highly unlikely that is your problem. I'd still check the fronts though.

The air I was talking about might be in the ABS unit itself. Which only works when the computer senses a locked wheel[s]. And then the computer turns on the ABS system. A call to a dealer might give you more info.
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