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water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

 
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Old 11 Dec 2015, 04:12 pm
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Default water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Hi everyone, I FINALLy got all the way in on my timing belt change project (2006 base model with 2.4 DOHC).

I'm preparing to install the water pump. I presume I though thoroughly clean the area of the engine that the seal presses againt. But when I am not so sure about is if I should use some RTV sealant in addition to the gasket. My impression is that it is best to just run a thin bead along the depression in the pump where the gasket sits, mostly to hold it in place during installation.

That sound right? The side of the gasket facing the engine shouldn't need any RTV, should it? Thanks!
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Old 11 Dec 2015, 11:05 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ushumgal View Post
That sound right? The side of the gasket facing the engine shouldn't need any RTV, should it? Thanks!
Really both sides officially don't need it but if the water pump groove isn't machined right or has a burr/nick, it can help seal up that defect.

My last install I didn't use any RTV but did lubricate the o-ring sparingly with o-ring lube so it can settle into position during installation.
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- 109K replaced timing belt/WP/tensioner/idler/crank&cam seals with same 1st gen design. That was a fun day and half!
- 119K Gates water pump failed after only 10K miles. Replaced with Airtex. This time around it was a 7 hour job.

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Old 11 Dec 2015, 11:38 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ushumgal View Post
Hi everyone, I FINALLy got all the way in on my timing belt change project (2006 base model with 2.4 DOHC).

I'm preparing to install the water pump. I presume I though thoroughly clean the area of the engine that the seal presses againt. But when I am not so sure about is if I should use some RTV sealant in addition to the gasket. My impression is that it is best to just run a thin bead along the depression in the pump where the gasket sits, mostly to hold it in place during installation.

That sound right? The side of the gasket facing the engine shouldn't need any RTV, should it? Thanks!
Yep. You've got it. Just make sure to clean the block really well before installing the pump. Also, assure the pipe coming out the back side behind the water pump isn't seeping. That pipe is seals with an o-ring that sometimes starts to leak a little.
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 12:02 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Thanks everyone! I had to use some 600 grit sandpaper to clean the mounting area on the engine block, so I used a thin bead of RTV both to hold the gasket to the pump, and another on top of the gasket to ensure than any tiny scratches will be sealed (see pic). Pump is on the car now with finger-tightened bolts, just waiting for the RTV to cure before torquing it down.
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 12:16 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Here is what is stated in the '06 Service Manual for water pump installation:

"2.0L/2.4L ENGINE
1. Apply MOPAR Dielectric Grease to new O-ring
before installation.
2. Install O-ring gasket in water pump body groove.
CAUTION: Make sure O-ring gasket is properly
seated in water pump groove (3) before tightening
screws. An improperly located O-ring may cause
damage to the O-ring, resulting in a coolant leak.
3. Assemble pump body (2) to block and tighten
screws to 12 Nm (105 in. lbs.).
4. Rotate pump by hand to check for freedom of
movement.
5. Fill cooling system (Refer to 7 - COOLING/ENGINE
- STANDARD PROCEDURE). Pressurize cooling
system to 103 Kpa (15 psi) with pressure tester
and check water pump shaft seal and O-ring for
leaks.
6. Install rear timing belt cover and camshaft sprockets
(Refer to 9 - ENGINE/VALVE TIMING/TIMING BELT AND SPROCKETS - INSTALLATION).
7. Install timing belt (Refer to 9 - ENGINE/VALVE TIMING/TIMING BELT AND SPROCKETS - INSTALLATION)."
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 12:18 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

*Good response ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^



The rule is if the part has a neoprene or rubber seal you don't use sealer that could cause the seal to slip and not seal properly.

If there there is a gasket or the manufactures are machine finished then you either use a approved seal for that type of mating surface or you apply a thin coat of seal to both sides let it set so when you touch it the sealer does not stick to your finger and then apply the two components to be seal.

This procedure is also for apply most gasket.


*This is the proper procedure to insure a leak free part. Unless the manufacture of either the part or the seal states other wise or unless the FACTORY SERVICE MANUAL has a specif warning or caution for any procedure having to do with a sealing component.


Hill billy methods, poor mechanics and even many less then experienced DIY tend to have their own ways they "think" is best but in the end most of those ways will eventually leak .


Do it right and correct the first time and you are not likely to have to re-do it.
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 12:58 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Thanks rckstein and NitroPT. The replacement pump and gasket I got did not have the little tabs to hold the gasket in place that the original pump and gasket had, so I needed to use something to hold the gasket to the pump. And I was concerned about some slight unevenness or tiny scratches in the mounting area from having to use 600 grit sandpaper which is why i put a bit more RTV on the engine side of the gasket.

I can imagine that the gasket will slip out of place as long as I tighten it to the correct torque. The RTV sealant I used said that you should install the part immediately, but only hand-tighten the bolts, and then torque them down once the RTV has had time to cure. That seemed to make sense to me, given my concern about tiny scratches or unevenness.
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 01:58 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

I put a thin film of rtv on mine. I didn't trust that o ring. If that leaked there's no way in hell id take it back apart.

i'm 35. i grew up in a generation that watched everything turn from american made to cheap chinese junk. sometimes i modify things before i ever even use them. i've yet to make anything worse than how i bought it. if we installed 500 waterpumps on 500 high mileage PT's, i'd bet the O-ring only group would have FAR more leaks.

Last edited by rob342; 12 Dec 2015 at 02:17 pm.
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 07:00 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

Thanks Rob, it's installed and all torqued down with a thin layer of RTV on both sides of the gasket. Going to make sure it has a minimum of 24 hours to cure, and then we'll see!
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Old 12 Dec 2015, 10:07 pm
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Default Re: water pump installation question (RTV sealant)

I've always had a personal rule of not using sealant with any sort of gasket just because the sealant can wash out before the gasket does. Or clog things etc... Unless its a valve cover gasket (where the OE seal had RTV).

To hold it in place I usually use a petroleum jelly. Just sticky enough so it sticks and won't cause any long term damage.
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