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AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

 
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Old 20 Jun 2016, 07:12 pm
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Default AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Alright, so far it has taken a journey to get to this point of trouble, let me walk you through it:
  1. Notice The AC Isn't as cold as it should be one day.
  2. Think, "hmmm its old, maybe rechgarge it?"
  3. Buy a can of 134a at Advanced Auto
  4. Toss on a gauge and watch it.
  5. Clutch engages, pressure drops to below 10.
  6. Clutch disengages, pressure drops to 80 - 90 - [HIZZZZZZZ]
  7. Did my pump just shoot out 134a all over the Advanced Auto Parking Lot? Sure did!
  8. Still only cold when car is going 40mph+...
  9. Play with it for a while.
  10. Notice sometimes the ac clutch will stay engaged for longer periods of time. Usually when the radiator fan kicks in at idle. (whether its high or low mode I'm not sure)
  11. Read that the fan is always supposed to be on when the AC is on.
  12. Mine just sits there.

Is this the cause of my issue? When the fan stays on, the pressure levels to around 15psi and the high pressure hose gets ice cold. But alas, soon I hear the pump stop and it gets hot again, then I run before my pump shoots freon out at me.
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Old 20 Jun 2016, 07:22 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

The pressures you are quoting do not make sense. A properly operating R134a system should read about 35-40 on the low side and 250, roughly, on the high side. You say the high side gets ice cold, that pretty much cannot happen unless you have some kind of restriction in the line. Are you sure you know which one is low and which one is high? Temp = pressure, roughly, so only your low side should "ice cold", the high side should be hot before the condensor and warm after the condensor.

If it is blowing out the freon, that would normally occur at 400+ lbs on the high side, if the relief valve is working properly.
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Old 20 Jun 2016, 07:44 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
The pressures you are quoting do not make sense. A properly operating R134a system should read about 35-40 on the low side and 250, roughly, on the high side. You say the high side gets ice cold, that pretty much cannot happen unless you have some kind of restriction in the line. Are you sure you know which one is low and which one is high? Temp = pressure, roughly, so only your low side should "ice cold", the high side should be hot before the condensor and warm after the condensor.

If it is blowing out the freon, that would normally occur at 400+ lbs on the high side, if the relief valve is working properly.
The gauge only connects to the low side. The low side 'big pipe' gets hot. The high side 'small pipe' gets cold.



^ Video of my guage and me listening for sounds etc....

This was before refilling it. I figured maybe the pressure was dropping too far when it was engaged (which it still is but I cant fix it because when it disengages the pressure spikes around 300 as it levels. I am wondering if the pressure spikes because the coolant is hot, aka, bad fan. Maybe that heat is why the pump turns off.)

Probably should have mentioned. The can of 134a DOES get cold once the fan starts running and the pump keeps running for a while. But usually its short lived and the fan stops, the pump kicks out, then the pressure spikes.
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Old 20 Jun 2016, 10:33 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

So even when the pump engages, the radiator fan does NOT engage. Pretty sure that's my problem.

My assumption is,

1, the fan should be on.
2, the pump cuts out due to overheat on the freon.
3, the temporary pause allows the temp to cool.

Or,

1, the fan should be on.
2, the fan being off generates heat which causes pressure to build.
3, the AC pump shuts off due to a pressure switch.
4, it cools, pressure lowers, and the cycle repeats.

Anyone think I'm close? I recharged it, it doesn't go below the green anymore. So it's not low on coolant by any means.

EDIT

Removed the [LOW] fan relay from the fuse panel. A/C works 100% fine and the fan spins. Looks like it's a bad relay?
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Old 21 Jun 2016, 07:34 am
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Just going by the gauge action and ignoring everything else, that is a classic low Freon situation. When the compressor comes on, it pulls down the low side to the "low" area on your gauge because there is not enough Freon. This causes the low pressure switch to kick out the compressor and the cycle starts over again.

If adding more Freon makes your compressor puke it out, then either there is a restriction on the high side making the pressure spike, or your relief valve is opening at a lower pressure than it should.

BTW I am saying "Freon" because you did, but "Freon" really means R12. R134a is named "Suva" but nobody calls it that. Just a bit of trivia to start your morning. :-)
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Old 21 Jun 2016, 10:48 am
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
Just going by the gauge action and ignoring everything else, that is a classic low Freon situation. When the compressor comes on, it pulls down the low side to the "low" area on your gauge because there is not enough Freon. This causes the low pressure switch to kick out the compressor and the cycle starts over again.

If adding more Freon makes your compressor puke it out, then either there is a restriction on the high side making the pressure spike, or your relief valve is opening at a lower pressure than it should.

BTW I am saying "Freon" because you did, but "Freon" really means R12. R134a is named "Suva" but nobody calls it that. Just a bit of trivia to start your morning. :-)
Hey, I think you missed the last part of my post? The freon is full. Removing the low fan relay makes everything work (except for the fan circuit throwing a cel).

So given removing that relay makes everything work...... I assume the fan circuit goes into a fail-safe mode which is why the fan works. So it seems the issue at this point is with the fan.
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Old 22 Jun 2016, 01:24 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Quote:
Hey, I think you missed the last part of my post? The freon is full.
I said, "Ignoring everything else" WRT the gauge reading. There is NO WAY your system is full if the low side is pulling down to 10-15 lbs. Exactly what are you seeing that tells you it is full?

Quote:
The low side 'big pipe' gets hot. The high side 'small pipe' gets cold.
This is exactly backwards of what normal operation should be.
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Last edited by jas88; 22 Jun 2016 at 01:27 pm.
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Old 22 Jun 2016, 10:37 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
I said, "Ignoring everything else" WRT the gauge reading. There is NO WAY your system is full if the low side is pulling down to 10-15 lbs. Exactly what are you seeing that tells you it is full?



This is exactly backwards of what normal operation should be.
Good news! I have an idea.

I replaced the relay (no change)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jas88 View Post
Exactly what are you seeing that tells you it is full?
I filled it after your initial message more and it only bottoms around 30lbs. Still keeps cycling though. The only way I have gotten it to stop cycling on/off, is to remove the low fan relay from the fuse panel. I can now hear the radiator fan kick in. I think this may boil down to an overheat condition caused by a faulty fan?
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Old 06 Jul 2016, 03:03 pm
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Default Re: AC Intermittent Clutch Issues...

It should cycle if you are getting down to 30#. This may be normal, tho, is your fan on low? If so, put it on full blast and see what it does.

Your posts seem to always have a contradiction that leaves me confused. This last one says you can hear the radiator fan kick in, but then you ask if the problem is a faulty fan? A fan that does not run is going to make the high side and low side pressures be too high to cool. If you are pulling down to 30 and cycling, then that is not the problem.

How fast is the cycling? What is the fan speed set on?
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