looking for advice - broken fuel line is todays issue.

[v_dragon]

Hello all...I have posted long time ago i think but I'm not much of a contributor.

I am looking for advice and input.

Today's issue is the nylon fuel lime that runs from the pump and around the tank to plug into the metal line that runs the length of the under body, has rubbed off at the corner and failed.
car go squirt
some pictures are on the blog...long story short the repair kit I found did not last a full week and I can't find a part number for this part anywhere.

its a 2002 PT, 2.4L, manual

input? ..i am just a poor working class knuckle buster, I'm not a mechanic or anything but necessity makes you learn to do things yourself.

The advise is this though...while i love my little PT it just turned over 140,000 and it seems to be needing a good deal of work and it has issues...Is it worth it?

If i fix the fuel issue, the rough,juttering under heavy acceleration, the worn clutch, the now fairly large oil leaks which just started (seems to be in 3 spots; back side of valve cover, drivers side of valve cover where the cam sensor is and all around where the oil filter is) , the goofy noise that i think is one of the NEW timing belt pulley’s, give it a good tuneup (plugs, wires), replace the sticking EGR solenoid...it likely needs shocks and CV's too..

It is worth it?...I am more used to my little Ford Ranger that ran perfect at 375,000 miles so If i put in all this effort on a commuter car/ grocery getter...do this guys have longevity or will it be a series of cascade issues?

Either way it has been a fun little car, i do like it..could do without the dash cover cracking and exploding into a million bits for no reason...

What do you guys think?

[Silver_Sleeper]

Just deal with 1 issue at a time and find a parts car on Craigslist that you can get cheap parts from. I would think fuel line would be the 1st...lol. how did the replacement line fail? Drive it till the wheels fall off, then fix it and drive it some more...

[rob302]

i would question the attention to detail on your repair of the fuel line. i've used one of those repair kits on a ford escape with the same connector type as the PT and the repair is going on 40k miles with no issue. i would also question who touched what back there to make the fuel line rub through in the first place. that should never have happened.

glancing at your blog i'm curious why you want to mess with the oil pump. at 276k with plenty of neglect and even more abuse, mine was still fine.

for the front and rear main seal, the front SHOULD have been replaced with the timing belt. if it was and it leaks already, i would again question the one that installed it.

rear main seal is cheap and the clutch is $140 on rock auto. this should take around 4 hours, 6 with beer

if both front and rear main seals are leaking, i would verify the PCV line is not kinked and the PCV rattles

egr.. you can clean it and if you still get codes, the EGR transducer is the likely cause and cost me ~$28.

at 140k my car had an axle and both wheelbearings and control arms replaced. you have come to a time where your car will need a few repairs, but after those it should be good for a while. i would guess you bought a car that was run into the ground instead of maintained, so "if it's worth it" will rely on your opinion.

[03PTCrewser]

Originally Posted by v_dragon

Hello all...I have posted long time ago i think but I'm not much of a contributor.

I am looking for advice and input.

Today's issue is the nylon fuel lime that runs from the pump and around the tank to plug into the metal line that runs the length of the under body, has rubbed off at the corner and failed.
car go squirt
some pictures are on the blog...long story short the repair kit I found did not last a full week and I can't find a part number for this part anywhere.

its a 2002 PT, 2.4L, manual

input? ..i am just a poor working class knuckle buster, I'm not a mechanic or anything but necessity makes you learn to do things yourself.

The advise is this though...while i love my little PT it just turned over 140,000 and it seems to be needing a good deal of work and it has issues...Is it worth it?

If i fix the fuel issue, the rough,juttering under heavy acceleration, the worn clutch, the now fairly large oil leaks which just started (seems to be in 3 spots; back side of valve cover, drivers side of valve cover where the cam sensor is and all around where the oil filter is) , the goofy noise that i think is one of the NEW timing belt pulley’s, give it a good tuneup (plugs, wires), replace the sticking EGR solenoid...it likely needs shocks and CV's too..

It is worth it?...I am more used to my little Ford Ranger that ran perfect at 375,000 miles so If i put in all this effort on a commuter car/ grocery getter...do this guys have longevity or will it be a series of cascade issues?

Either way it has been a fun little car, i do like it..could do without the dash cover cracking and exploding into a million bits for no reason...

What do you guys think?

The fuel line issue:

Use something like this to fix the damaged corner of nylon fuel line



Rough juttering under acceleration:

1st thing to do is a compression test. If the compression is low on any cylinder, plus everything else you have listed, I'd cut losses. If compression is good, it MIGHT be worth your time and money to repair all other issues.

Spark plugs and wires:

$50

Upper manifold gaskets:

$7

Worn cluth:

If you do yourself at home it's anywhere from $150 to $300 for a clutch depending on what you want.

Oil leaks at valve cover:

$60 or less to repair at home minimal effort.

Oil leaks at oil filter:

$50 or less to repair at home

Noisy external idler pulley, likely not the timing belt idler pulley:

$60

CV shafts:

$200-$300 depending on what you buy. Easy to replace if you have air tools. No air tools, the job sucks.

Struts/shocks:

$250-$400 depending what you buy. Sucks without air tools to replace. Complete struts with springs already installed are available. That's easiest for diy at home without full compliment of tools.

You're already up to $1000 and this is if you do the work at home. Whether is worth it or not all depends on how much you like the car.

[v_dragon]

Well, the repair kits the auto stores had were just a piece of flexy hose, the brass insert and some squeeze rings. I felt it was pretty low quality and it took me awhile to get the squeeze clamps to not leak when sticking my thump on one end of the hose and 20 psi on the other...seems there is not part number for the hose itself, it was part of the entire fuel tank assembly from the dealer and they stopped making them....Unless I can find other ideas, i will just stick regular fuel line in its place and see how that goes...not sure about attaching it to the plastic fuel pump outlet though, a hose clamp may squeeze too hard? The only type of connector the local stores were the type where you have two squeeze points, will that seal on the outlet?

I could not see anything it was rubbing on, no paint missing on the body, no rub marks on the tank that I could discern but there was a definite nick in the tube.
By oil pump, i really meant to say the oil filter elbow gasket and have a good look at whats going on. While I try and do my own maint. in the winter I let and oil change place do it ONCE, they cranked the filter on so hard that it had to be forcibly removed and it backed out the filer nipple with it. I always have had a little wet there now so...

The only person that has touched the car since I have had it was me other than an oil change from time to time and tires. I got the car used from a dealership like 8 years ago. It only had 28000 on it (nobody wanted a stick with a big damn flat-pull RV hitch sticking out of the front so it was a good price)

When I did the timing belt, I did not realize about the special tool to remove/put the timing cog back on, somehow that detail did not find its way into the research i did on the job so that why the front main seal was not done with the timing belt.

I'll have a look at your EGR and PVC suggestions, Sometimes during wild temperature/pressure weather changes the car will idle poorly, I have come to find out the popping the EGR valve vac tube off and putting some positive pressure into the EGR valve make it run normal again so i was thinking it's getting stuck/control solenoid not functioning proper like - sometimes it will toss a EGR flow error when it does this.

Thanks for the info and food for thought.
^_^

Originally Posted by rob302

i would question the attention to detail on your repair of the fuel line. i've used one of those repair kits on a ford escape with the same connector type as the PT and the repair is going on 40k miles with no issue. i would also question who touched what back there to make the fuel line rub through in the first place. that should never have happened.

glancing at your blog i'm curious why you want to mess with the oil pump. at 276k with plenty of neglect and even more abuse, mine was still fine.

for the front and rear main seal, the front SHOULD have been replaced with the timing belt. if it was and it leaks already, i would again question the one that installed it.

rear main seal is cheap and the clutch is $140 on rock auto. this should take around 4 hours, 6 with beer

if both front and rear main seals are leaking, i would verify the PCV line is not kinked and the PCV rattles

egr.. you can clean it and if you still get codes, the EGR transducer is the likely cause and cost me ~$28.

at 140k my car had an axle and both wheelbearings and control arms replaced. you have come to a time where your car will need a few repairs, but after those it should be good for a while. i would guess you bought a car that was run into the ground instead of maintained, so "if it's worth it" will rely on your opinion.

[v_dragon]

Man, i wish I had seen one of those at the store..prolly would have fixed me right up...what so you use to clamp the hose onto it, or is it sufficient as it is on the barbs?



Rough juttering under acceleration:

1st thing to do is a compression test. If the compression is low on any cylinder, plus everything else you have listed, I'd cut losses. If compression is good, it MIGHT be worth your time and money to repair all other issues.

Good idea, thank you



Noisy external idler pulley, likely not the timing belt idler pulley:

$60

Whats got me wondering is the fact that the goofy noise started started immediately after replacing the timing belt...Now it's not that new timing belt whir noise, I know about that...it sounds to me like its a bearing. the idler/tensioner I got with this kit were GMB brand i think, they seemed built good but the external idler..i.e. the belt running the power steering and AC will be easy-ish to test I'll just remove the belt and have a listen.

CV shafts:
No air tools, the job sucks.

Struts/shocks:
Sucks without air tools to replace.

yeah, i only have the 240 lbs electric impact but that should do me if i can get the monster into place....a good set of air tools and the compressor to run them is my wish list -_-

You're already up to $1000 and this is if you do the work at home. Whether is worth it or not all depends on how much you like the car.

1000 -vs- several grand and or payments for another car....I like my car...he's kinda ugly though...deer damage, top coat on roof decided one year to fall off..dash cap cracked; gives it character!

Good info, thanks for you input ^_^

[Silver_Sleeper]

When I repaired my fuel line i didn't use clamps, it said to soak line in hot water for 10 minutes to make it playable. I used a heat gun instead and was just careful to not get too close. It was still a pain to slide onto the barbs. But works great and no leaks

[v_dragon]

well...took a few tries...the first try using the flexy hose repair kit failed after a few days...eventually I found the right type of splice connector. I never did find anyone that carried the elbow. I hit it with 100 PSI on the bench and nary a leak so time will tell.

I called the dealership just for the hell of it and the parts department said "Buy a new car, you can't get that part, it was only offered pre-installed by ordering the ENTIRE fuel tank assembly. Not only it that tank assembly not made any more but we don’t have one and neither does any other dealer. Also, don't go to a junk yard, there were some recalls and you might get a part that will burn down your car."...

Doorman part 800-059, doorman 800-181 with the connectors and clamp rings tossed in the garbage and 2 NAPA 730-4910, some closed cell foam, vinyl tape and a little duct tape to hold the hoses in place while i wiggle the tank up in its hole.

So far, so good. Next i'll do that compression test once i am satisfied this repair is going to hold out to see if the rest of the car is worth putting in th $ for its upkeep.
Again, thanks all for the info and input.

[rckstein]

Originally Posted by v_dragon

well...took a few tries...the first try using the flexy hose repair kit failed after a few days...eventually I found the right type of splice connector. I never did find anyone that carried the elbow. I hit it with 100 PSI on the bench and nary a leak so time will tell.

I called the dealership just for the hell of it and the parts department said "Buy a new car, you can't get that part, it was only offered pre-installed by ordering the ENTIRE fuel tank assembly. Not only it that tank assembly not made any more but we don’t have one and neither does any other dealer. Also, don't go to a junk yard, there were some recalls and you might get a part that will burn down your car."...

Doorman part 800-059, doorman 800-181 with the connectors and clamp rings tossed in the garbage and 2 NAPA 730-4910, some closed cell foam, vinyl tape and a little duct tape to hold the hoses in place while i wiggle the tank up in its hole.

So far, so good. Next i'll do that compression test once i am satisfied this repair is going to hold out to see if the rest of the car is worth putting in th $ for its upkeep.
Again, thanks all for the info and input.

Can you please indicate on the tank pic where the area is that rubbed through and failed? Hard to believe that, under normal use and vehicle operation, that any lines would have come into contact with anything to cause it to fail.

[03PTCrewser]

That stainless steel barbed elbow in the pic I put before would have been hard to find around you locally. I found it at a soda dispenser parts website. Sorry I didn't mention that earlier. The fuel line could have gotten nicked during removal or install of the the tank in the past and it took awhile to spring a leak.