Hybrid Performance

[strangelove]

Well I for one agree with you On Bush's lack of leadership and the inability to choose a good energy plan that will bring the US to true oil independence. Something we need to remember is that markets follow the crowd. If everyone continues buying gas there will be a market to serve those customers. If prices go up and people still continue to purchase gas, things get really competitive and we will see aggressive markets. I work for Chevron so I know how aggressively an oil company follows earnings. When money is flowing in Chevron tends to throw more money at it to make more money. Can't tell you all the ins and outs of the oil industry, but what I can tell you is that Chevron is very much prepared for supplying product to emerging markets. I have worked on PR projects that involve Hybrid vehicle testing, that has been going on for the past 6 years. Hydrogen Fuel cells powering entire buildings at the Richmond and San Ramon research facilities. I've even seen their plans on making money of of solar power, how in the world does someone make money off of something that is free to everyone. Beats me, but Chevron has found a way. So my point here is that most oil companies have contingencies for this type of thing, oil will never be phased out like last years car models. What will happen is a gradual move towards profitable markets. Car manufacturers will follow suit, there are no companies that have a master plan on how to gouge Americans, but they do have plans on how to make a profit. And isn't profit the American way, this is what capitalism is all about. So my whole way of looking at the price of fuel problem is to look for ways to alleviate the problem. If it costs to much for fuel, drive less. If it costs to much to drive then I'll ride a bike or take public transit. When it comes to my next car purchase you better believe I'm not going to make the mistake on buying a gas guzzling SUV, or a compact that gets sub par MPG. My next purchase will be a Hybrid that I can plug in and get 100 MPG, or a super light flex fuel car to run errands around town, since thats what I do most of the time. Driving here driving there to meet with clients or buy supplies, of do a job, or meet with friends. So whenever Chrysler eventually gets their head out of the sand about fuel technology and starts offering more fuel efficient, more innovative products the inevitable will happen, the market will move somewhere else.

[robinjoe]

Tweet,

I understand that you haven't purchased a PT Cruiser, but your just shopping. If that's correct, I don't recommend one for you. The gas mileage isn't good enough, and every time you fill the tank, you'll think you're just pouring money in to GW Bush's bank account. It will piss you off to no end.

Go out and buy a Honda Civic hybrid. It's the only way you can live with yourself.

By the way your dead wrong about Bush, and are living in a fantasy land if you think he is anything like King George. I mean Bush is way too liberal for my taste, and compromises with the Democrats way too often, but overall he's just trying to walk the thin line between security and privacy.

[Tweet]

Well, y'know, Robinjoe, gas milage is all relative. Compared to the 396 Chevelle I just got rid of, a PT would be a major step towards conserving.
And you're definately right, George W is no King George.(Kings, after all, have an air of majesty about them) But I still see correlations. I guess it a matter of interpretation.
For those who would like to decide for themselves, you can look here:
http://www.archives.gov/national-arc...sit/visit.html
You're also right about my living in a fantasy world, but that's OK, they all know me there!

[robinjoe]

Hey Tweet, Politically, we're probably at oposite ends of the spectrum, but I like your style.

BTW, I've got a copy of the US Constitution hanging on my bulletin board at the office. I guess I'll have to add a copy of the Declaration of Independance too. We certainly need to keep an eye on our government. I'm a conservative, but sometimes I think Republican leaders take our votes for granted, and are as "bad" as Democrats.

Likewise, I see Democrats doing the same to Liberals and the "black vote". They know that liberals aren't going to vote for Republicans, so they take them for granted.

Sorry, I digress again. Basically I'm just saying that most Liberals and Conservatives have the best wishes of our nation at heart. The fact that we can all speak up is what makes our nation great. God bles America.

Joe

quote:Originally posted by Tweet

Well, y'know, Robinjoe, gas milage is all relative. Compared to the 396 Chevelle I just got rid of, a PT would be a major step towards conserving.
And you're definately right, George W is no King George.(Kings, after all, have an air of majesty about them) But I still see correlations. I guess it a matter of interpretation.
For those who would like to decide for themselves, you can look here:
http://www.archives.gov/national-arc...sit/visit.html
You're also right about my living in a fantasy world, but that's OK, they all know me there!

[strangelove]

Funny how politics always gets in the conversation whenever talking about hybrid vehicles. Although the govenment helps technology along by allowing tax subsidies and incentives, government really has no bearing on how the public will recieve hybrids. It really falls on to supply and demand and also the ability for companies to provide relevent products to a receptive market. Just like politics there is a lot of misinformation out there about hybrids. So for me hybrid and politics are not a good mix, I prefer talking about one or the other. So since this thread was started to talk about hybrid technology and how that technology could be applied to our PT Cruisers then could we get back to that. Thanks

[strangelove]

Check out the Toyota CS&S another concept vehicle that uses a gasoline engine to power the rear wheals and a hybrid synergy drive to power the front wheels.

quote:Here we have a 1.5 litre petrol-engine in the rear, driving the rear wheels mechanically. At the same time it produces electrical current, either for storage or for driving the front-wheel hub-mounted electric-motors. That means, supposedly, that this car can use the whole range, from pure rear-driven, via fourwheel-drive with variable front/rear split, to pure electric-powered, zero-emission front wheel drive.

[strangelove]

Could this be Daimler Chrysler's attempt into the Hybrid Market? Looks like a small enough platform to be enginered to work for the PT.

[strangelove]

I've been having this hybrid conversation with a lot of people and the same issue keeps coming up. "If I get a hybrid the upfront cost will outweigh the savings in fuel for the life of the car." or "Hybrids are to un-tested and the maintinence cost will outweigh the savings in fuel." While both these issues are relevent I can't help but see the irony in the whole thing. Staying in the domestic realm, the difference between buying a Hybrid Ford Escape 4wd ($27,000)compared to a similar featured Ford Escape XLT ($24,000) the difference is about $3,000. When you take into account that there is a state and federal tax incentive of $2,600 to $3,000 depending on location that narrows the gap to costing about the the same.

Also I don't know of anyone that doesn't need to do maintenence on their car, my PT has had about a few thousand in mantinence over the past three years and I don't see that cost getting any less as time goes by. As cars get older they just end up costing more to maintain, whether it be hybrid or combustion, there will always be cost to keep aging cars on the road. All I know is my neighbor has had a Prius for two years and his maintinence costs are same as mine. In my opinion it's all relative, depending if your the type to keep a car for over five years, or the type to keep a car for your entire life. In five years sell it or trade it in for a new car, if you keep it for life maybee you should get something more street proven.

What really gets me though is that nobody ever talks about how someone might upgrade a hybrid. Go to any car forum and everyone is talking about how to upgrade engine performance, bolt on hp, dropping in a new engine, etc. What about upgrading hybrid components. The only commercial application I've seen of this is an uprade for Toyota Prius' to convert it into a plug in to increase mpg to 100. What I want to know about is how could you upgrade a battery array with lighter lithium longer running and longer life. Also what might happen if you upgraded the electric engine. Simmens is doing some interesting things with some powerful electric motors. By the way Simmens is working with Daimler Chrysler on hybrid concept vehicles for their Mercedes lines. I hope that some of this filters down to the Dodge and Chrysler divisions.

[strangelove]

Here is DaimlerChryslers first attempt at a Hybrid, http://www.orionbus.com/orion it's called the Orion and these buses will be rolling the streets of San Francisco as of today. New York should be seeing a fleet of 50. Guess DC is going for the mass transit set first. Hard to see this scaled down to work for DC's consumer vehicles any time soon. Interesting to note that DC's consumer vehicle sales in North America is down 11% this quarter, given that consumers are ignoring their gas guzzling vehicle line.

[fritz_t_coyote]

Just one more little though on the in-wheel electric motors:

Unsprung Weight, the enemy of decent handling.

And seeing how PTs already handle like a fart in a shovel, this won't help.