Katrina Victims

[Espresso]

So you were a brat & that was all you knew. The comfortable lifestyle. Joined to make daddy proud?

When did I ever turn my back? You may spell & use proper punctuation..good for you. But it looks like I have you beat in comprehension, which is a hellof alot more important, in this world because it you cant comprehend you look retarded. Especially for someone who knows computer & is retired military. Hell, I'm lucky I still have finger to type with, I could care less about impressing you if I screw up a few word. I really dont care. You dont want to read what I have to say ignore me. It isnt that hard. Hell I had to read the thread 3 times & barly noticed your fist post.

Actually I have said & many know where i'm going & why. Just because you cant figure it out isnt my problem.

You have a nice day now.

[^]

[robinjoe]

quote:Originally posted by quicksilverdon

Obviously it was reported - you found it.
The point is, because you seemed to have missed it:
TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE.
"...are expected to join the effort within the next 48 hours..."
48 hours can be counted in many lives...

I hesitate to continue this thread since it has gotten so hostile. I am simply trying to give the side of the story which is being ignored by the mainstream media.

The paragraphs I reported were from the National Guard website, not the mainstream media.

The 11,000 National Guard and 7,200 active-duty troops were on the scene August 31, and the additional 10,000 were expected 48 hours from then. That means they should have been there today.

The "conservative" media (Fox) is just as bad (or worse) than the "liberal" media when it comes to reporting bad news over good news. They are just selling advertising, and bad new sells better than good news.

I recommend going to the source: Dept. of Homeland Security, National Guard, Red Cross, etc. to see the "other" side. Don't ignore the "bad news" media, because what they are reporting is important too, and we don't want to get only the "rosy" view from the government agencies either. We need to make sure we are getting a balanced view.

Espresso,
You are right about the logistical screw-ups at the Convention Center. Sometimes Government agencies play it too safe. It's that beurocratic mentality, and that's one of the big screw-ups I keep refering to.

I'm not "backing up the president", aside from saying it's not his fault. The best he can do is stay out of the way. The last thing we need is more beurocratic mentality from him or any other politician.

NeHope,
Thank you for your service to our country, and I think you are right about the mess in Louisiana. I had no idea they made no provision to get them out before the storm.

Let's keep the peace and remember that, as far as Katrina is concerned, we're all on the same team. We ALL want those people to be saved.

[coolvanillagt]

Espresso, I honor your service to our country. Because of your sacrifice, you have the freedom to decide to leave for a better, more perfect country. Godspeed.
As a staunch Bush supporter, I admire our President for admitting there were problems to be dealt with. Does doing so save lives instantly? no. Does it indicate a willingness to be honest and self examining? yes. I wonder what Bill would have said, or who he would have blamed? According to the Kennedys', this situation is the result of Bushes' pulling of funding to support the war, his lack of substantial concern for global warming(a theory) and probaly by now, some connection to "big oil" lining his families pockets. Let us not blame New Orleans or the state of Louisiana for ingoring warnings from decades past, for its failures to protect its own citizens. Somehow, it must be our countries fault, the conservative rights fault, evangelicals fault and of course the evil Bush, behind it all.

[quicksilverdon]

quote:Originally posted by coolvanillagt


As a staunch Bush supporter, I admire our President for admitting there were problems to be dealt with.

1. on FRIDAY
2. But no fault of his own - ever
3. by a FEMA buddy of his with no experience

C'mon, you'd be all over a democratic president for such a dismal performance - admit it.
The man is inept.

[satellite66]

I think what the too little too late Bush bashing crowd is trying to say is that Bush gained to much respect with the public after the 9-11 attacks and we can't have him doing the same thing here. They tried to do the same thing after 9-11 because they waited a couple of hours. This time the media had their stories and the DNC had it's press releases ready days before Katrina.

[quicksilverdon]

quote:Originally posted by robinjoe
I hesitate to continue this thread since it has gotten so hostile. I am simply trying to give the side of the story which is being ignored by the mainstream media.

The paragraphs I reported were from the National Guard website, not the mainstream media.

The 11,000 National Guard and 7,200 active-duty troops were on the scene August 31, and the additional 10,000 were expected 48 hours from then. That means they should have been there today.

The "conservative" media (Fox) is just as bad (or worse) than the "liberal" media when it comes to reporting bad news over good news. They are just selling advertising, and bad new sells better than good news.

I recommend going to the source: Dept. of Homeland Security, National Guard, Red Cross, etc. to see the "other" side. Don't ignore the "bad news" media, because what they are reporting is important too, and we don't want to get only the "rosy" view from the government agencies either. We need to make sure we are getting a balanced view.

Espresso,
You are right about the logistical screw-ups at the Convention Center. Sometimes Government agencies play it too safe. It's that beurocratic mentality, and that's one of the big screw-ups I keep refering to.

I'm not "backing up the president", aside from saying it's not his fault. The best he can do is stay out of the way. The last thing we need is more beurocratic mentality from him or any other politician.

NeHope,
Thank you for your service to our country, and I think you are right about the mess in Louisiana. I had no idea they made no provision to get them out before the storm.

Let's keep the peace and remember that, as far as Katrina is concerned, we're all on the same team. We ALL want those people to be saved.

I apololgize. I got too emotional.
when I read:"People who were stranded in the flooded areas of New Orleans were taking their chances. I don't buy the excuse that some were too poor, or didn't have a car. The low lands of New Orleans isn't that big. They could have walked to higher ground and shelter. There are numerous agencies and help available for the invalids who couldn't walk. They had two days notice!"
You couldn't have ever been to New Orleans - I have. It is destitute.
It is below sea level. There IS no higher ground to walk to. They were told the stadium was available and went there. Many stayed to protect their homes - they shouldn't have, true, but screw them?

I took your earlier posts to say - 1) It's their own fault, and 2) enough was being done, and I feel very strongly against both those points.

I think the voice of the media onsite was loud enough that it finally was heard.

It appears that FINALLY real progress is being made - we should demand this never be allowed to happen again - meaningful relief was too slow in coming.

I happen to think lowly of Bush, but I am not an avid Democrat - I feel most politicans suck - but this is beyond politics - this is a tradgedy that was very poorly dealt with. I will think a bit better of Bush if there are some dismissals after determining what went wrong, but I don't hold my breath, because Bush should have driving this effort from Monday on, not showing up Friday.

[quicksilverdon]

quote:Originally posted by satellite66

I think what the too little too late Bush bashing crowd is trying to say is that Bush gained to much respect with the public after the 9-11 attacks and we can't have him doing the same thing here. They tried to do the same thing after 9-11 because they waited a couple of hours. This time the media had their stories and the DNC had it's press releases ready days before Katrina.

If you truly believe he and his appointees did a good job, that's really sad.
What DNC press releases? What DNC? They have been pitifully silent and are more poorly organized than relief efforts were.
I am basing my feelings on what I have seen and read from any TV station and any newspaper. The facts are speaking, not political rhetoric.

[satellite66]

quote:Originally posted by quicksilverdon

If you truly believe he and his appointees did a good job, that's really sad.
What DNC press releases? What DNC? They have been pitifully silent and are more poorly organized than relief efforts were.
I am basing my feelings on what I have seen and read from any TV station and any newspaper. The facts are speaking, not political rhetoric.

The DNC has been silent? Did you hear Howie the screamer Deans comments?
I realize that Bush did not get on TV tear up and talk about how he feels their pain like has been done in the past, but given the size and scope of the disaster could the response and preparedness have been better? Sure that is what is always said after events such as this. We heard the same thing from the left after 9-11. When it comes from the left and their allies in the media everything negative that can be dealt to Bush will be first and foremost.

[robinjoe]

quote:Originally posted by quicksilverdon
I apololgize. I got too emotional.
when I read:"People who were stranded in the flooded areas of New Orleans were taking their chances. I don't buy the excuse that some were too poor, or didn't have a car. The low lands of New Orleans isn't that big. They could have walked to higher ground and shelter. There are numerous agencies and help available for the invalids who couldn't walk. They had two days notice!"

You couldn't have ever been to New Orleans - I have. It is destitute.

It is below sea level. There IS no higher ground to walk to. They were told the stadium was available and went there. Many stayed to protect their homes - they shouldn't have, true, but screw them?

I took your earlier posts to say - 1) It's their own fault, and 2) enough was being done, and I feel very strongly against both those points.

I think the voice of the media onsite was loud enough that it finally was heard.

It appears that FINALLY real progress is being made - we should demand this never be allowed to happen again - meaningful relief was too slow in coming.

I happen to think lowly of Bush, but I am not an avid Democrat - I feel most politicans suck - but this is beyond politics - this is a tradgedy that was very poorly dealt with. I will think a bit better of Bush if there are some dismissals after determining what went wrong, but I don't hold my breath, because Bush should have driving this effort from Monday on, not showing up Friday.

Thanks Don for your post. I can see what you mean about my posts. I don't mean to imply that the victims should be be allowed to perish for their errors. However, I don't think Bush should be blamed for it either. Blame the weather and the idiots who decided to build the city below sea level.

Probably 75% of the people who were trapped have themselves to blame. I browsed New Orleans on Google Earth and It seems like the areas to the North of rte. 610 are well-to-do single-family homes with swimming pools and golf courses.

The areas to the South of 610 are within 2.6 miles of the Superdome. That's ten laps around a track. They could have walked there in about 1 hour. Even invalids could have been pushed there in about 1.5 hours. The city issued a MANDATORY evacuation.

You're right, I've never been to New Orleans, so I may be way off base, but the lack of evacuation shouldn't be blamed on Bush. He didn't even have the authority to do anything until the governors authorized it... It's called Federalism.

A close friend of mine was one of the planners from Virginia pre-positioned August 26 to start planning for this. These are experienced planners who have responded to nearly all the major hurricanes and natural/man-made disasters for years. They weren't apointed by Bush or any other president. They are the ones making the real decisions and planning. But there is just no way to do enough with a disaster of this magnitude.

I will try to get some first hand information from him when he returns (who know when). As of Friday, no one (not even his wife) had heard from him since Monday. These guys aren't sitting around in armchairs watching "Friends". They are making the hard life and death decisions: Do you save the 20 old people at a nursing home, or a family of 8 with five young children. Do you bring comfort to 15,000 people in a stadium where 10 may die, or do you save the lives of 300.

I stand by what I said earlier. The best thing Bush and Congress can do is provide cash and stay out of the way and let the emergency personnel and National Guard do their job. They are doing everything they can to save life, but it can never be enough, and lives have and will be lost.

[quicksilverdon]

I am not blaming Bush for the fact so many people were trapped - I'm blaming him for the slow response to the disaster.
NOW we're seeing meaningful numbers of helicopters, and National guard.
WHAT TOOK SO LONG?

Satellite 66-
not worthy of a response -
No I haven't heard Dean.
Even Fox news has pictures that tell the tale. You feel nearly a week without water, food and authority is acceptable? I don't.