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2004 engine swap

 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 27 Sep 2010, 08:15 pm
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Default 2004 engine swap

2004 w/113k

I was asked to look at a car for a friend. Thus far my limited experience with the PT's was timing belts and water pumps. I did not really need too much working on those as the repair was straight forward.

The owner said she heard a clicking sound from the front end of the car. Then the oil light came on. then she said the transmission light came on and the car coasted to a stop when the engine stalled.
I am not stupid and I'm 98% certain that she saw the check engine light.

Anyway. My first instinct is to say she spun a bearing due to low oil. However her oil level was fairly good. And the motor is not seized in anyway and will not restart.

I then checked the timing belt and it is not broken and rotating fully. Oil light goes out during cranking so I presume pressure is being acheived and thus lack of oil circulation is probley not a cause. Low pressure is possible. Engien turns over nicely without much effort.

I could not hear a fuel pump but no testing was done on this to check either way.

Spun bearing and freely rotating engine should still allow for the motor to run.

Jumped timing, and from what I am reading on this forum, these are not interference, should be a simple fix.

Car has fuel.

I figure that the worse case is she requires a new motor.

Now from reading the Hollander exchange:
2001-2002 swap out
2003 single year
2004 single year
2005-2009 swap out

However I alson know that often you can swap manifolds, sensors, EGR....ect, and other years can fit. Even if you gotta swap a camshaft like on my ECOtec.

I am pretty sure the 05+ cars had a different crank reluctor set-up and will not work without harness and ECM....
But will the older motors work?

Any help would be great.
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Old 27 Sep 2010, 08:30 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Kind of hard to diagnose from a distance but if the engine turns over normally, the timing belt isn't broken and you have fuel . See if there is any codes in the PCM. Do the 3 key turn trick and see if it throws any codes. Secondly check whether it's a fuel or fire problem. Simple trick is to use brake clean or carb cleaner. Spray it in the throttle body. It it starts and tries to run then it's a fuel problem. If not then it's ignition or something else. Do a compression check next. That should give you a good direction to go with. Let me know where that gets you.
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Old 27 Sep 2010, 09:46 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Yeah starting fluid will be my first step and then work down from there.
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 08:34 am
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Why not check for spark?
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 09:43 am
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Starting fluid does check for spark.
If car starts=you have spark.
if car does not start=you have either no spark or incorrect timed spark

I do this stuff all the time, but as a general rule I avoid and Dodge products. They are often over complicated for no good reason I can think of, and while many good ideas are in them, they prove to be hassles to the home mechanic.
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 06:28 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

I went over to where the car is located today.
Ok, I first tried to hook up my fuel pressure gauge but was unable to locate the port? WTF??
So skipped that part and just removed the intake tube and poured some gas into the intake. Car fired right up.


Blew out tons of smoke though. Looked blue so I presume oil, or maybe just because I flooded the engine out basically.

I then pulled the intake and ran a compression test. About 185 +/- 3psi across the board.

Plugs looked great and using the timing light I see spark is happening. Wires looked newer and cleaner than the rest of the motor.

So I pulled the fuel line at the firewall. Cranked engine and fuel poured out. I reconnected line and tried to start. Still no start.
I did not have a means of testing for injector pulse at this time.

I then ran codes (seems silly to do that last eh?).
P0113
P0522

I am chosing to ignore the IAT as I had it disconnected when trying to start at one point. So I expect that code. The low oil pressure puts me on another track. Are these cars set up to cut fuel or something when the code is set off? I know GM has a variation of this where the PROMM cuts spark if low oil pressure is discovered.

At this point I am thinking one of three issues:
bad fuel pump is not building enough pressure to start at all (engine does not even cough)
faulty injector drivers (ECM or wiring)
jumped timing

When you pour gas into the intake it runs and idles perfect. No noise from the motor. CEL stays on. No other lights come up.
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 08:18 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Sounds like a fuel problem. That I know of the p0522 shoudln't cut off the fuel pump. Replace the oil pressure sensor first. Then follow the fuel line back to you find a quick disconnect. Unplug it and crank the engine. See if fuel comes out. Also check for power and ground at the pump. If you have power and ground then most likely it's a pump.
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 08:35 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Ok my bad I didn't see the part about opening the fuel line.
Based on My experience I would look at the camshaft sensor. It controls the injectors. Need to check for injector pulse.
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Old 28 Sep 2010, 08:43 pm
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

As I said, the fuel pump turns on. I did disconnect the fuel line and checked that fuel poured out when the pump was activated.
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Old 29 Sep 2010, 07:26 am
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Default Re: 2004 engine swap

Quote:
Originally Posted by slartyblarfast View Post
Ok my bad I didn't see the part about opening the fuel line.
Based on My experience I would look at the camshaft sensor. It controls the injectors. Need to check for injector pulse.
But doesn't cam sensor also control spark? Car runs fine as long as gas is poured in, that implies spark is good.
Points to injectors - something in common, since there isn't a cough when cranking, so all injectors don'e fire.
See is there is a ground wire loose - follow injector wiring and look....
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nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."
Isaac Asimov"

'05 Limited Turbo Lite, (Silver, of course)4-wheel ABS, Sunroof, Spoiler. Mods: E&G Classic grill, K&N FIPK, BTG duals, rear lowered 1.5", LED washer lights, $20 catch can, Aoogah horn, Weatherflectors, Sunroof Deflector, Fuzzy Dice, rear logo flames, rear pinstripe graphic, Gen3 Taillights, rear sway bar, hood struts, Strut bar.
Traded in '02 Silver Touring Edition w/87,000 miles
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