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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 08 Oct 2010, 11:40 pm
mdfrodolives's Avatar
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Default Re: transmission slip

This is one of those issues that reminds me of a fable I once heard when I was a teen. It went like so:

"Two boys were out back, behind the wood shed, and they were ... well, let's just say they were being naughty (but not with each other). Anyway, their grand-pa came around the corner and said: "If you boys keep doing that, you'll go blind!" Well, after the old man turned back toward the barn, one of the boys looked at the other and said: "So let's just keep doing it 'till we need glasses."

Taking the above into account, I can see that some here have trouble opening their eyes to the fact that their personal experience is not always a good way to judge what is the correct course to take.

For instance, some here believe that PT Automatic Transmission re-learning is an unnecessary myth. But I wear glasses, you see, and my experience with my auto/trans fluid change, offered an entirely different reality. Before my fluid change, my trans shifted perfectly. After the "dealer" fluid change, my transmission shifted completely (and very noticeably) different from when I first brought the car in for the service. The dealer (the following day) ran a program that "re-learned" my transmission. And from that moment on, the transmission has shifted wonderfully.

The poor shifting was not an illusion. At times (under certain procedures and at certain times) when messing with your automatic transmission, "re-learning" is required.

For those of you who still have your "copyrighted" illegal shop manual, check out the last line in the procedure for changing your auto trans soleniod. It states something to this effect: Run relearn program. Why? Well, simply because you pulled two hoses (that transmit fluid) off the solenoid, I assume. But whatever the reason, there are times when relearning is necessary.

Still, you can call the farmer a fool, if you like, but maybe the old man knew a thing or two, after all; because I suspect that most of us on this forum do, indeed, wear glasses ....

Tim
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 09 Oct 2010, 01:39 am
cruserdad1976's Avatar
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Default Re: transmission slip

Tim

I 100% belive you had to relearn your tranny and if the book says so then it must be
However on mine i dropped the pan pulled the filter and replaced it put pan back on filled it us and was good to go with out a relearn

I think we all know that each car is a tad different just look at the different MPG's everyone gets

people are different cars are different heck they make over 100 flavors of ice cream cause of it

Ill just except that i was one of the ones who snuck by
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 09 Oct 2010, 07:45 am
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Join Date: Jun 2010
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Default Re: transmission slip

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdfrodolives View Post
This is one of those issues that reminds me of a fable I once heard when I was a teen. It went like so:

"Two boys were out back, behind the wood shed, and they were ... well, let's just say they were being naughty (but not with each other). Anyway, their grand-pa came around the corner and said: "If you boys keep doing that, you'll go blind!" Well, after the old man turned back toward the barn, one of the boys looked at the other and said: "So let's just keep doing it 'till we need glasses."

Taking the above into account, I can see that some here have trouble opening their eyes to the fact that their personal experience is not always a good way to judge what is the correct course to take.

For instance, some here believe that PT Automatic Transmission re-learning is an unnecessary myth. But I wear glasses, you see, and my experience with my auto/trans fluid change, offered an entirely different reality. Before my fluid change, my trans shifted perfectly. After the "dealer" fluid change, my transmission shifted completely (and very noticeably) different from when I first brought the car in for the service. The dealer (the following day) ran a program that "re-learned" my transmission. And from that moment on, the transmission has shifted wonderfully.

The poor shifting was not an illusion. At times (under certain procedures and at certain times) when messing with your automatic transmission, "re-learning" is required.

For those of you who still have your "copyrighted" illegal shop manual, check out the last line in the procedure for changing your auto trans soleniod. It states something to this effect: Run relearn program. Why? Well, simply because you pulled two hoses (that transmit fluid) off the solenoid, I assume. But whatever the reason, there are times when relearning is necessary.

Still, you can call the farmer a fool, if you like, but maybe the old man knew a thing or two, after all; because I suspect that most of us on this forum do, indeed, wear glasses ....

Tim
well tim according to chris (he works at chrysler dealer ) there is no such thing as re-learn tranny after fluid flush!!
but i found this at alldatadiy.com in transmission maintanance section
"QUICK LEARN PROCEDURE
The quick learn procedure requires the use of the scan tool. This program allows the PCM to recalibrate itself. This will provide the best possible transaxle operation.

NOTE: The quick learn procedure should be performed if any of the following procedures are performed:



•Transaxle Assembly Replacement
•Powertrain Control Module Replacement
•Solenoid/Pressure Switch Assembly Replacement
•Clutch Plate and/or Seal Replacement
•Valve Body Replacement or Recondition
"

so chris must be right as you dont need to relearn the tranny but it might work sometimes as in your situation
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 09 Oct 2010, 10:32 pm
mdfrodolives's Avatar
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Default Re: transmission slip

Bug, the dealer's shop told me that "sometimes" when they change the fluid in the auto trans, they "lose the prime" because they don't refill it all the way up ... to begin with. They start with a bit under, then start the engine, then add as they go. In my case, the guy said my prime was lost, which caused my transmission to "revert" to its "unlearned" (initial) state. Thus, they had to "relearn" (Quick Learn, I assume) the thing, he said.

The whole process seemed silly to me, but after they had my car for 5 minutes (and told me they were "relearning the transmission"), and I subsequently drove off their lot--the transmission shifted beautifully. The day before--when I had them change out my fluid--the car shifted entirely differently then normal (at the wrong times, in other words), after I drove off their lot.

But after hearing that Crewzin, and several others, either had their trans fluid changed at places like Jiffy Lube, etc., or did the job themselves, without any "relearning" B.S., then I decided to do the next change myself.

I am a bit reluctant to change my auto trans solenoid pack, however, since the "illegal" manual calls for a "Quick learn" after doing the job. But the seal is leaking on my PT (in the winter) and since they don't just sell the gasket to the solenoid, I have to buy and replace the whole shebang eventually.

Doing so doesn't seem all that difficult--except for the relearning crap at the end of the job. Still, I'm up for doing it myself, since the dealer wants $375.00 to do the job (it's about an hour's labor, tops).

My point was that it was possible (on some PT's) to require "relearning" (Quicklearning) when the fluid is changed. If not, then the dealer lied to me, and they possibly put in the wrong fluid by mistake, of forgot to do something else that was so ridiculous that the dealer felt compelled to lie about the cause of the strange shifting after they completed their work.

The original poster stated that he changed his fluid, and then his trans started acting up. I thought the cause might have been similar to what happened to me, so I proposed a solution that worked in my case.

By the way, has anyone replaced their auto trans solenoid pack? And if so, did you have to take the car in for a "Quick Learn" when you were done?

Let me know.

Tim
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 10 Oct 2010, 06:12 am
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Default Re: transmission slip

Frodo, I'm not sure where you got your "factory manual", but it's obviously not factory. This is word for word directly from Chrysler's factory manual for the 2001 PT Cruiser. No where does it mention relearning the transmission, because as I've already stated, it's not required!

FLUID AND FILTER SERVICE - TRANSAXLE
NOTE: Refer to the maintenance schedules in LUBRICATION and MAINTENANCE, or the vehicle owner's manual, for the recommended maintenance (fluid/filter change) intervals for this transaxle.

NOTE: Only fluids of the type labeled Mopar® ATF+4 (Automatic Transmission Fluid) Type 9602 should be used. A filter change should be made at the time of the transmission oil change. The magnet (on the inside of the oil pan) should also be cleaned with a clean, dry cloth.

NOTE: If the transaxle is disassembled for any reason, the fluid and filter should be changed.

FLUID/FILTER SERVICE (RECOMMENDED)
1.Raise vehicle on a hoist. Refer to LUBRICATION and MAINTENANCE for proper procedures. Place a drain container with a large opening, under transaxle oil pan.
2.Loosen pan bolts and tap the pan at one corner to break it loose allowing fluid to drain, then remove the oil pan.
3.Install a new filter and o-ring on bottom of the valve body Filter and O-Ring
4.Clean the oil pan and magnet. Reinstall pan using new Mopar Silicone Adhesive sealant. Tighten oil pan bolts to 19 N·m (165 in. lbs.)
5.Pour four quarts of Mopar® ATF+4 (Automatic Transmission Fluid) Type 9602 through the dipstick opening.
6.Start engine and allow to idle for at least one minute. Then, with parking and service brakes applied, move selector lever momentarily to each position, ending in the park or neutral position.
7.Check the transaxle fluid level and add an appropriate amount to bring the transaxle fluid level to 3mm (1/8 in.) below the lowest mark on the dipstick Dipstick Markings
8.Recheck the fluid level after the transaxle has reached normal operating temperature (180°F.) Refer to Fluid Level and Condition Check for the proper fluid fill procedure.
9.To prevent dirt from entering transaxle, make certain that dipstick is fully seated into the dipstick opening.
DIPSTICK TUBE FLUID SUCTION METHOD (ALTERNATIVE)
1.When performing the fluid suction method, make sure the transaxle is at full operating temperature.
2.To perform the dipstick tube fluid suction method, use a suitable fluid suction device (Vacula™ or equivalent)
3.Insert the fluid suction line into the dipstick tube
NOTE: Verify that the suction line is inserted to the lowest point of the transaxle oil pan. This will ensure complete evacuation of the fluid in the pan.

4.Follow the manufacturers recommended procedure and evacuate the fluid from the transaxle.
5.Remove the suction line from the dipstick tube.
6.Pour four quarts of Mopar® ATF+4 (Automatic Transmission Fluid) Type 9602 through the dipstick opening.
7.Start engine and allow to idle for at least one minute. Then, with parking and service brakes applied, move selector lever momentarily to each position, ending in the park or neutral position.
8.Check the transaxle fluid level and add an appropriate amount to bring the transaxle fluid level to 3mm (1/8 in.) below the lowest mark on the dipstick Dipstick Markings
9.Recheck the fluid level after the transaxle has reached normal operating temperature (180°F.) Refer to Fluid Level and Condition Check for the proper fluid fill procedure.
10.To prevent dirt from entering transaxle, make certain that dipstick is fully seated into the dipstick opening.
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2010 PT Cruiser Classic, Deep Water Blue
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 10 Oct 2010, 11:30 pm
mdfrodolives's Avatar
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Default Re: transmission slip

heifetz, you may call me "Tim", if you like. The screenname (md) Frodolives refers to a saying you might have seen written in the dust on a few old Volkswagens in the sixty's--the words meaning something to the effect that "... there is still hope". Yes, a bit corny perhaps, but as I get older, the closer I seem to gravitate toward the West end of Middle Earth, despite all the extra attention the nuns gave me in grammar school.

Now, back to the main subject. I "procured" the 75 megabye "manual" on this forum, back, sometime before it was pulled, due to copyright infringement. It appears to be genuine, so I have faith in its authenticity. Of course, the moment I found that it was contraband, I destroyed it with all the pics I had of the Olsen twins and the neighbor's two Siamese cats.

Anyway, I did not quote the manual, concerning the necessity of a "Quicklearn" (re-learn, or whatever you want to call it) when changing the ATF. If you re-read my post, I said that the manual said something to the effect that a "re-learn" (Quicklearn) should be done after replacing the automatic transmission solenoid pack. I also mentioned that replacing this little, leaky gem of a solenoid seemed easy enough--but that you had to remove two trans lines to do it (well, something along those lines).

So, the Quicklearn process I mentioned was referring to the changeover of this particular item--and only mentioned the same re-learning process when "sometimes" changing the oil, as a theory born of the information given to me by the dealer.

I also mentioned that the dealer was the one who told me that they needed to do a relearn (Quicklearn) on my PT ... and after they supposedly did this (in five minutes flat), my transmission ran beautifully. Then I added that the dealer may have lied to me about this "relearning" B.S. just to cover up some mistake they may have made when they changed my auto trans oil.

Still, when they rectified the mistake--which they said was the simple addition of a "re-learn", the trans purred like a kitten, ran high, and jumped fast--as well or better than a pair of Keds on the unwashed feet of a gangly teen in junior high gym class.

So ... there it is. I'm off to Bedlam ...

Tim
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