PT Cruiser Forum  
Advertisements
       

Go Back   PT Cruiser Forum > General Forums > Tech & Performance Forum

PT Cruiser Forum

Advertisements
An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

 
Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By randyincctx

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11 Mar 2014, 11:49 pm
Young Cruiser
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 51
Default An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

This began about a month ago when the roommates bitched at me asking "what the hell" I had done to the care. When all I had done was top off the oil.

They complained that the car was literally shaking at idle. normally I can make it shake a little bit by turning a bunch of stuff on while sitting in a parking lot- all the headlights(hi/lo), the rear defrost, and putting the car in reverse. Normally, that drops the revs to about 800 and she starts to shake a little bit.

I demonstrated this, and they said that wasn't the kind of shaking they had experienced.

After that, it kind of went to stalemate, with no one having evidence to prove one or the other situation to be true.

Until today. I think I experienced it again. It seemed to me that one cylinder wasn't firing, and it made the idle sound kind of like that of a diesel. By that, I mean patterns, there was a noticeable shake from the engine, that coincided with an audible wavering in the pitch of the engine. Indeed, the revs were fluctuating as well, all in this sort of diesel-idle-pattern. This was in the parking lot as I was about to leave for classes.

Here's where it gets odd, at least to me. Starting the car in the first place seemed to take more effort than normal. Also, I found a car charger plugged into the port on the center console, the one that always has power from the battery. This charger has a light in it, but being there also suggests, to me, that someone was charging a phone while the car was off.(This, and they gripe at me all the time about having left the dome lights on, which would require putting the dimmer ring all the way forward, a thing that I never do.)

Adding to my theory, is that after a while, without putting the revs up or turning anything off; literally, while i sat there and listened to it, thinking about what it might be, it resolved itself. Idle went back to normal, at a constant frequency of ignitions, the whole nine yards.

This all adds up in my mind as, somehow there was enough power drained from the battery that for a while, there wasn't enough power for one cylinder to fire. An additional detail that seems to mesh with the theory is that it just smoothed right out. Not choking, sputtering, or anything that might suggest a flooded cylinder. It's almost as if the computer purposefully shut off that one cylinder.

I wrote this up, though, to ask if such a thing is possible. Does the computer really do that? Do the mechanisms have that much inherent intelligence? I'm further bewildered by this phenomenon because of the lack of DTC's. I still only have P 0582 and P0586, both relating to the cruise control(which I'm going to actually tack on to the end of this post). There are absolutely no error codes about a misfiring cylinder, or anything.

I do know the battery we have is a Rayovac battery. I don't really trust Rayovac. I may be really paranoid about this, but I'm thinking the battery is weak already, after just a year and a half, since the interior lights very noticeably dim after cutting engine power, as do the headlights. Perhaps that is normal and I'm just freaking out over nothing, but my main question in this thread is whether or not this could be an electrical problem and/or a weak battery problem.






Now, about the cruise control, I've searched far and wide, and found no answers. The codes I mentioned above are listed as being issues with the "Vacuum" and "Vent" solenoids. What the cruise control does right now is as follows:

At any speed, when the cruise control button on the end of the control stick is pushed, the servo momentarily pulls the throttle, and then releases it, refusing to respond until the engine is restarted- upon another button press, this process repeats.

I can find no parts online anywhere to match these two solenoids the error codes mention. I'm wondering if they're parts of the servo or not, but I'm also wondering if it's that "canister vent solenoid" That I think I'm seeing just under the master cylinder.

Cruise Control is not a crucial part of the car, but it is still broken and I want to fix it when I can. The biggest barrier right now is finding out what parts I need to buy and replace. Not to mention how to replace whatever parts need it.
__________________
Onyx Green PT Cruiser Touring; Totaled @ 174k
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12 Mar 2014, 09:13 am
Obsessed Cruiser
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 27,744
Default Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

OK first, NO the computer can't just shut off one cylinder. Some high end Cadillacs and a couple other cars do shut off some cylinders to save fuel but the PT sure doesn't do that.

What you need to do is start with an ignition parts change. We always/usually tell people this so it takes away guessing if the plugs or wires are at fault. Next, you need to clean and re-tighten all the cables that go from/to the battery but that AFTER you take the car to an auto store and have them check the battery and charging system. That will rule out that part of the equation. Don't forget the grounding cables from the battery. There's one or two under the battery itself, check the wires. Then after all that, see if your problem still exists.

On your cruise control, there's no part of the cruise that I can think of near the master cylinder. What you probably have is a small leak in one of the vacuum hoses. The servo is over by the passenger side. It's a cone shaped, black object with a wire coming out of the pointed end which goes over to the throttle control wheel. There's also a vacuum line attached to the cone that goes behind the engine and over to the brake booster. Check all the vacuum lines at the servo and brake booster. Follow them as far as you can to see if there's any cracks.
__________________
Rules of the forum have been updated as of *07/07/2019* Please read them over.

- All decisions by the Moderator are semi-permanent, can and may be changed at his discretion but definitely will be the final word. Any action performed by the Administrator or Moderators are not to be discussed on the forum.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 13 Mar 2014, 01:23 am
Young Cruiser
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 51
Default Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

Quote:
Originally Posted by CREWZIN View Post
OK first, NO the computer can't just shut off one cylinder. Some high end Cadillacs and a couple other cars do shut off some cylinders to save fuel but the PT sure doesn't do that.

What you need to do is start with an ignition parts change. We always/usually tell people this so it takes away guessing if the plugs or wires are at fault. Next, you need to clean and re-tighten all the cables that go from/to the battery but that AFTER you take the car to an auto store and have them check the battery and charging system. That will rule out that part of the equation. Don't forget the grounding cables from the battery. There's one or two under the battery itself, check the wires. Then after all that, see if your problem still exists.

On your cruise control, there's no part of the cruise that I can think of near the master cylinder. What you probably have is a small leak in one of the vacuum hoses. The servo is over by the passenger side. It's a cone shaped, black object with a wire coming out of the pointed end which goes over to the throttle control wheel. There's also a vacuum line attached to the cone that goes behind the engine and over to the brake booster. Check all the vacuum lines at the servo and brake booster. Follow them as far as you can to see if there's any cracks.
I follow. I should have been more clear, though.

We JUST had a tune-up done. New wires, new plugs. So that part -should- be out of the question already. The charging system has not been tested recently, though, so that's where I'll see about starting. It's technically not my car, so that might be difficult(Especially since a certain roommate seems to think it's his car, when it's titled to my mother.) Thankfully, there's an Autozone nearby that in a pinch I could walk to. I've been thinking of saving up for a load tester from Harbor Freight Tools. I might have been too late on that, though.

I'm certain I can check the "battery ground" wires, but if anyone has any picture of what I'm looking for I'd greatly appreciate it.

And Crewzin, on the cruise control: I would normally agree, but I should mention this: If I pull the vacuum hose off of the servo(Yeah, I know that part's identity at least), then it starts sucking air like something we might not name in this forum. That to me says there are no vacuum leaks. We actually had that looked at, too, I believe, though I'm not as sure on that part as I am about the tune-up.

So at this point, perhaps it is the servo. Maybe these two solenoids the codes talk about are within the servo? IT's the only thing that makes a lick of sense now..
__________________
Onyx Green PT Cruiser Touring; Totaled @ 174k
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 13 Mar 2014, 08:06 am
Obsessed Cruiser
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 27,744
Default Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

Found this in a search and might help with diagnosing the cruise control problem:

http://www.justanswer.com/chrysler/7...t-cruiser.html
__________________
Rules of the forum have been updated as of *07/07/2019* Please read them over.

- All decisions by the Moderator are semi-permanent, can and may be changed at his discretion but definitely will be the final word. Any action performed by the Administrator or Moderators are not to be discussed on the forum.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 13 Mar 2014, 04:00 pm
Young Cruiser
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 51
Default Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

Quote:
Originally Posted by CREWZIN View Post
Found this in a search and might help with diagnosing the cruise control problem:

http://www.justanswer.com/chrysler/7...t-cruiser.html
So then perhaps these "solenoids" are part of the servo itself. I really wish the error code system wouldjust say it's a bad servo. :/ Well, I'll also have to save up and get a new servo at some point, then.

The engine shaking issue is still weirding me out, though. If I'm lucky, I might be able to take the car to Autozone and have them test the battery. Unfortunately, my current nerve problem causing pains in my right side might disallow that- Although, I do have a volt meter. I can probably test it myself with that, I just need to figure out what voltages I SHOULD be seeing if it's a good battery.
__________________
Onyx Green PT Cruiser Touring; Totaled @ 174k
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 13 Mar 2014, 06:02 pm
randyincctx's Avatar
Veteran Cruiser
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Corpus Christi,Tx.
Posts: 3,485
Cool Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kittera View Post
We JUST had a tune-up done. New wires, new plugs. So that part -should- be out of the question already.
Please clarify.....Did you do a tune-up(plugs/wires/etc.),or did you have a tune-up done?
Because if it's the latter,you cannot eliminate that from the equation!
I've seen where mechanics have broken plug insulators,stripped plug holes,and plugs commonly gapped incorrectly.....Need I say more?
Just because you paid someone for a tune-up,doesn't mean it's always done correctly.
767skyking likes this.
__________________
2003 PT Cruiser (Base-N/A) Patriot Blue Pearl Purchased @ Police Impound Auction for $1,000.
Aka:~KILLER~
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 14 Mar 2014, 01:38 am
Young Cruiser
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 51
Default Re: An odd occurrence or two(regards a possible cylinder misfire, and cruise control)

Quote:
Originally Posted by randyincctx View Post
Please clarify.....Did you do a tune-up(plugs/wires/etc.),or did you have a tune-up done?
Because if it's the latter,you cannot eliminate that from the equation!
I've seen where mechanics have broken plug insulators,stripped plug holes,and plugs commonly gapped incorrectly.....Need I say more?
Just because you paid someone for a tune-up,doesn't mean it's always done correctly.
We did have someone do it, but by someone more qualified to do so than I am. Not to mention, the mechanic we had do it is the only person of my most paranoid friends trusts to even touch his cars.

I just got the car to Autozone and had them test the battery. The battery checked out, as did the starting and charging system when tested.

I'm honestly not sure, based on what I know, that it could be the ignition system. The problem is intermittent and if the engine is stopped and restarted, it goes away. I'm starting to think it might be the computer. That or a sensor somewhere, but I'm getting no codes. The only sensor throwing codes is the oil pressure sensor(P 0522), and even that is intermittent.
__________________
Onyx Green PT Cruiser Touring; Totaled @ 174k
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cylinder 3 misfire michalo187 Tech & Performance Forum 12 28 Jan 2017 09:30 pm
New to forum, need serious help w/ Cylinder 2 and 3 Misfire RedComet Tech & Performance Forum 20 10 Apr 2012 11:01 pm
Misfire In Cylinder 4 shoe989 Tech & Performance Forum 13 23 Feb 2011 03:56 pm
cylinder 2 misfire problem flexse1 Tech & Performance Forum 1 07 Oct 2009 05:58 am
Cylinder Misfire TaylorMade Tech & Performance Forum 6 16 Jun 2005 05:01 pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:09 pm.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2 © 2011, Crawlability, Inc.
vB.Sponsors