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Old 22 Aug 2014, 12:11 pm
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Default Spark Plug Change?

It's been about 36,000 miles since I had the spark plugs replaced on my '05 Touring with 86,000 miles on it (last done at 50,000.) I was told by an "expert" local mechanic that says he knows about the 2.4 engine and that it's time to replace the plugs (although the engine runs just the same as the day they were put in 36,000 miles ago.) The current plugs in it are Bosch (with the 4 tip) but the mechanic says it's best to replace with the stock factory Champions. Why would that be? And if the engine is running just fine, no changes that I can detect and same gas mileage, then why do I have to? Hey, I don't mind spending the $$$ if the item is needed, but why the money if it is not? Thanks for an opinion.
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Last edited by thecabinguy; 22 Aug 2014 at 12:17 pm.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 12:31 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecabinguy View Post
It's been about 36,000 miles since I had the spark plugs replaced on my '05 Touring with 86,000 miles on it (last done at 50,000.) I was told by an "expert" local mechanic that says he knows about the 2.4 engine and that it's time to replace the plugs (although the engine runs just the same as the day they were put in 36,000 miles ago.) The current plugs in it are Bosch (with the 4 tip) but the mechanic says it's best to replace with the stock factory Champions. Why would that be? And if the engine is running just fine, no changes that I can detect and same gas mileage, then why do I have to? Hey, I don't mind spending the $$$ if the item is needed, but why the money if it is not? Thanks for an opinion.
Hes blowing smoke. most spark plugs should last at least 100,000 miles. But I change mine at 80,000.

you can always take them out and read them to determine how engine is performing. IE lean, rich, spark plug seal leaking... ETC

The 4 tip spark plug is not worth the money. You only have one electrode, and 4 ground tips... the spark will take path of least resistance so the other 3 tips are pointless.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 01:08 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?


Last edited by NitroPT; 22 Aug 2014 at 01:11 pm.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 01:10 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Your plugs should be changed and your engine is most likely not running as good as it could be.

The gradual decline in engine performance can not be felt by most people. You may not have even noticed that your MPG has decreased or may going that hill takes a little more throttle than it did a year ago?

Spark plugs are an inexpensive part that most anyone can change in a hour or 2 even with little to no experience.

I would recommend also changing the spark plug wires. Manly because most people have a decency to damage them when changing the spark plugs.

I am with your mechanic on the spark plug recommendation and always use Champion Single Electrode spark plugs gaped at .035-.042.

************************************************** ******
MNTEGRA01 your description of how the Bosch Platinum+4 Spark plug work is
not accurate.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 01:24 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

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Originally Posted by NitroPT View Post
MNTEGRA01 your description of how the Bosch Platinum+4 Spark plug work is
not accurate.
Please correct my mis-information. I dislike bad information on forums. I do like healthy education and learning how a sparkplug actually works.

Sorry, I did give half truths. Iridium/Platimun plugs should last 100,000 miles. NOt just any plug.
I will agree to use OEM Champions in your car if its engine is stock.
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Last edited by MNTEGRA01; 22 Aug 2014 at 01:32 pm.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 01:37 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MNTEGRA01 View Post
Please correct my mis-information. I dislike bad information on forums. I do like healthy education and learning how a spark plug actually works.
There is plenty of information on this forum about spark plugs. I recommend use search feature if you are so inclined and interested

I personally have posted many responses of IMO good and factual information about automotive secondary electrical system on a PT Cruiser over the last 2 years. Seems you have been "lurking" around this forum before joining in the last year you may have even read a few?

I am just saying that your response is just not accurate. What is ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by MNTEGRA01 View Post
.. the *spark (*this should be technically electricity) least resistance so the other 3 tips are pointless.
You can not say the spark because combustion chamber air velocities and turbulence can effect the flame kernal.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MNTEGRA01 View Post
you can always take them out and read them to determine how engine is performing. IE lean, rich, spark plug seal leaking... ETC
This is not correct technically anymore since around the mid 90's. You can only accurately read spark plugs optimum spark if a power run and read is done. By simply adjusting the throttle position or idling down the engine speed will change what the spark plug will look like. The only time this "old school" spark plug reading works is if there is a extreme change in engine performance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MNTEGRA01 View Post
I will agree to use OEM Champions in your car if its engine is stock.
What does this mean? If it were not stock you wouldn't use them?

HMM? I use Champion single ground electrode in my Super Gas Camaro that makes a little over 1200HP? My PT Cruiser which is also slightly modified and even when more engine mods are done will continue to use Champion Spark Plugs?


BTW "GM parts Guy" I actually like AC Delco Spark Plugs in some applications also.
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Last edited by NitroPT; 22 Aug 2014 at 01:48 pm.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 02:04 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Thanks Nitro.

OP was asking for opinion, I gave mine. I do see where combustion turbulences and air velocities would cause ignition spark to possibly change to different ground prong on the Bosch 4's.

I was suggesting if it is a stock engine, use what Chrysler designed it with. And if you use Champion plugs in your Camaro, means nothing, its the design and model you use, copper, iridium, platinum. Whatever it be, a Champion plug is just not any old Champion plug. You left out valuable information, might be secret for you since its a cool 1200HP. But I hope you get what I'm trying to say.

Likewise, OP could have done his own searching too. I just trying to be helpful to someone who may be getting ripped off and/or is less eduacted about vehicles than I am, or you or many other knowlegable users here.

Thanks,
Mac
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 02:11 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Thanks so much, MNTEGRA01 and NITROPT for all of your information. Really appreciate it. Plug wires were replaced at 50,000 but will do them again with the plugs. Car is going in soon to the dealership for engine mount replacements so will have them do the full tune-up, too, then I shouldn't have to worry about that stuff for a long time.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 02:23 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MNTEGRA01 View Post
Thanks Nitro.

OP was asking for opinion, I gave mine. I do see where combustion turbulences and air velocities would cause ignition spark to possibly change to different ground prong on the Bosch 4's.

I was suggesting if it is a stock engine, use what Chrysler designed it with. And if you use Champion plugs in your Camaro, means nothing, its the design and model you use, copper, iridium, platinum. Whatever it be, a Champion plug is just not any old Champion plug. You left out valuable information, might be secret for you since its a cool 1200HP. But I hope you get what I'm trying to say.

Likewise, OP could have done his own searching too. I just trying to be helpful to someone who may be getting ripped off and/or is less eduacted about vehicles than I am, or you or many other knowlegable users here.

Thanks,
Mac
Mac...no secret plain old COPPER TOPS for the PT Cruiser and the race cars.
And like I said there is plenty of information about this topic on this forum.

Chrysler did not design the engine for any specif spark plug like most auto manufactures the bean counters not engine designers have that say about what is used.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecabinguy View Post
Thanks so much, MNTEGRA01 and NITROPT for all of your information. Really appreciate it. Plug wires were replaced at 50,000 but will do them again with the plugs. Car is going in soon to the dealership for engine mount replacements so will have them do the full tune-up, too, then I shouldn't have to worry about that stuff for a long time.
At 50k this wires should be replaced.

If it is going to the dealership you may suggest the parts you want to be used. Other wise lotsa $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I would also would go in as an informed customer to the dealership. You might mention to the service writer that you want to make sure the installation of the mounts is done as per the service manual. Yo can say you are aware there is a specif procedure that can have an effect the longevity of the mounts and also how you will feel the engine when idling specifically if ATX in gear.
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Old 22 Aug 2014, 02:37 pm
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Default Re: Spark Plug Change?

Sorry Mac I can't find my AC's and the rest of my spark plug stash right now but here a couple pictures I just took in the garage.

People make spark plug choice way more complicated than it really needs to be. Maybe because of so many choices and advertising. I think I have tried every new spark plug that has come available since the early 80's. Having the access to my engine Dyno for a few years I was able to see exactly what really worked. My conclusion was the simpler the better. Single ground just plain works. Other exotic spark plugs with heat and wear resistance material may live longer but they still wear and wear means loss in performance. IMO I recommend to buy inexpensive single electrode spark plugs and change them at no more than about 20k tops.

I don't care what brand or type spark plug if you run an engine on a scope with spark plugs that have been in a vehicle that is a daily driver after about 20k you can see a decline. All you need do to set a delta is change one cylinder with a new spark plug of the same type and run the test.




For PT Cruiser Turbo engines

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