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Old 25 Aug 2017, 12:16 pm
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: North Central KY
Posts: 26
Default Overheating Issues

Hey guys and gals! It's been a while since I've been on here but I guess that's kind of a good thing that Ye Olde Cruiser has been working well enough for so long, right?

Well I have a doozy of an issue going on right now. I'll give you the full scoop on this from the start to now.

Had a total radiator failure back about a year ago and had it towed into the shop from the interstate to get it replaced. The shady ass shop that did it didn't bleed or burp it properly so it worked a little while then started having issues again. That wasn't all they did either. They went out of business soon after I had mine worked on that summer. (apparently from ripping people off)

So wintertime rolls around and I can feel heat radiating from the vents but no hot air blowing. Not only that but it has started to overheat when driving again.

I take it to a different place who is wonderful and trustworthy and told them all that happened and sure enough the other place had intentionally went in and disconnected something (I can't remember what it was that they told me) to prevent it from blowing hot air. They didn't come right out and say the words that the other place had screwed me but upon further questioning they said that it couldn't have happened accidently or have just happened on it's own. Yeah... Also they had to replace the mount and a wire under the filler valve (tube the cap is on, sorry, I'm REALLY bad at knowing the names of the parts and I don't claim to be any kind of mechanic at all). Oh and also I discovered after hitting a cocker spaniel sized possum on the way home from work one early morning where it busted part of my front bumper off and took the plastic screen off the front that the place that replaced my radiator had also not remounted the little power steering (? I think that's what it is) radiator thing that sits in front of and beneath the radiator. It was only fastened on one side and the other side was hanging down.

So it runs good all winter then this spring it starts overheating again. I change the thermostat (yay! learning to work on it myself!) and discover that the people that changed my radiator out the first time ALSO didn't put a gasket on it, instead there was blue goop that they used that did not seal it at ALL.

Get that changed out and fast forward a few months and lo and behold overheating AGAIN.

At first it only does it when the car is idling at a light on the road. Doesn't do it when idling in park (of course it could have but I never sat with it running for an hour to test).

I burp it again and there's a small drippage coming from somewhere but I can't figure out where. After I burp it it runs good for about a week or two. Eventually gets to where I'm burping every day to every other day.

Then I notice a little trail of fluid on the ground when I pull out of work one morning that follows me. Water pump I figure. I get it home, park it, and have a mechanic friend come down to look at it. Turn it on and water is pouring out from underneath. Yep, bad water pump.

So it takes about 2 weeks (having to source out and find the right screw at the dealership and then having to borrow the right harmonic balancer installer from same dealership). We put on a new water pump and change the timing belt. Put it back together and it should be running, right?

Well no. It's still overheating. Overheating fast. I burped it again and I'm gonna use the bleeder valve but I also noticed that the fan is not turning at all now. FML. *head hung in defeat*

So here is where I'm at.

I know I need to check the fan and roughly how to get it off but I'm not sure what else I need to check (or how) when it comes to the plugs and wires and stuff.

I am seriously ready to cry. My lil Cruiser has been so good to me for so long and gotten me through the worst weather imaginable to and from work (I'm 911, we don't get to call out of work when the roads are bad in the winter) and has made 2 trips back and forth from Kentucky to New York. It's a 2006 Touring Edition (non-turbo) and has over 150,000 miles on it. So I either have to get this issue fixed or (worst case scenario) have to just get another car.

How expensive of a fix am I looking at here and is it worth it to continue to triage my Cruiser? I really love my little car and I don't want to get rid of it. If it can be salvaged even if only for a few more years that would be best financially. I'd rather paid a few hundred to fix than a few thousand to get a new car.

If it's just this fan or connectors I might be able to do it myself (I hate to ask the mechanic friend to do it since he just finished that 2 week job and did all that for free). It would work out better financially because I can't really afford to have someone fix it or the tow it would require to get it there right now after spending so much over the last two weeks on parts and tools. (I drove about a quarter mile or less yesterday down the road to test it after burping it and it started overheating bad. Driving to the shop is not an option.)

Any guidance or advice would be greatly appreciated for this novice wrench tinkerer who doesn't know the technical terms for things (LOL, Dohickey and whatsit are common in my vocabulary. I can see it and understand what it is but then when trying to recall the technical name it escapes me most times.)

I've been watching a lot of videos on the subject so I think I need to take the fan out, get alligator clips to test the fan itself, and I think there's two connectors I need to check?

There's a junk yard down the road a bit I might be able to get parts from or at worst can order them from RocAuto if the parts stores in town don't have them. I just REALLY need to get my Cruiser up and running again.

(EDIT TO ADD ps. I have checked the oil and it's not milky, also not blowing white smoke from the exhaust. There is an oil leak that I will eventually have to address and likely have to get a new head gasket considering the age and miles on it but it doesn't appear that there's coolant leaking or mixing in. I've started to use just plain water in it for the moment since it's still nice hot summer temperatures right now. Mechanic friend put in proper coolant when changing out the water pump though. Also I wonder if there could be a clog in the reservoir since prior to the water pump change it didn't appear to be cycling at all. It still had the colored coolant in it even though when I was topping up the radiator I was using straight water. If so could that be part of the overheating issues?
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Last edited by 911Gal; 25 Aug 2017 at 12:25 pm. Reason: Additional info
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Old 25 Aug 2017, 12:34 pm
rckstein's Avatar
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Default Re: Overheating Issues

Your mechanic saved you a ton already by doing the timing belt work for free. They must be a glutton for punishment, or enjoy challenges.

If you find out all you need is a cooling fan, don't mess with the junk yards, you can get one practically anywhere for less than $100.

Hang in there and someone will be along shortly to guide you.
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Old 25 Aug 2017, 12:39 pm
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: North Central KY
Posts: 26
Default Re: Overheating Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by rckstein View Post
Your mechanic saved you a ton already by doing the timing belt work for free. They must be a glutton for punishment, or enjoy challenges.

If you find out all you need is a cooling fan, don't mess with the junk yards, you can get one practically anywhere for less than $100.

Hang in there and someone will be along shortly to guide you.
Yes he did! That was a serious PITA job. I was right there with him the whole time doing what I could but most times it just ended up being holding the flashlight and squirting WD40 on bolts. LOL. He is a saint is basically family is all but blood. i don't know what I'd do without him. He's my best friend's hubby and I'll message her with "Can I borrow your husband?" and she already knows the car is having issues. LOL. Good to know the fan is cheap!
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Last edited by CREWZIN; 25 Aug 2017 at 01:09 pm.
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Old 25 Aug 2017, 12:55 pm
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Default Re: Overheating Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by 911Gal View Post
Yes he did! That was a serious pain in the ass job. I was right there with him the whole time doing what I could but most times it just ended up being holding the flashlight and squirting WD40 on bolts. LOL. He is a saint is basically family is all but blood. i don't know what I'd do without him. He's my best friend's hubby and I'll message her with "Can I borrow your husband?" and she already knows the car is having issues. LOL. Good to know the fan is cheap!
Remember them at Christmas time, or throughout the year with small gifts, that can mean a lot and you certainly want to remain friends with them.

Also, on the fan, if you do end up getting one, you should get one that includes the relays and wiring harness. They also sell them bare for a few dollars cheaper. But the harness or relays could also be part of the problem, and it's not that much more for a complete assembly.
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Old 25 Aug 2017, 01:56 pm
Cool Cruiser
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 256
Default Re: Overheating Issues

While you wait for some assistance, i suggest you checkout the below link to see if your fan is working properly...

Replaced Radiator Fan Assembly - Still no fan movement
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 25 Aug 2017, 02:29 pm
Fk5 Fk5 is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Colesville, MD
Posts: 1,816
Default Re: Overheating Issues

+1 with Grasshopper

Some of these problems (even going back to your previous jobs) might just be the fan, the wiring, or the relay(s). Follow the steps to check. You have come this far, the fan is an easy job once it is diagnosed and you have come so far already!

I am a bit concerned with your comments that it overheats fast. I don't think the head gasket is much of a problem on these cars, unless you let them get hot. The iron block/aluminium head combos traditionally don't like that. Don't let it get hot! Shut it down ASAP once the gauge starts moving above halfway.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 25 Aug 2017, 06:01 pm
Fresh Cruiser
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: North Central KY
Posts: 26
Default Re: Overheating Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by rckstein View Post
Remember them at Christmas time, or throughout the year with small gifts, that can mean a lot and you certainly want to remain friends with them.

Also, on the fan, if you do end up getting one, you should get one that includes the relays and wiring harness. They also sell them bare for a few dollars cheaper. But the harness or relays could also be part of the problem, and it's not that much more for a complete assembly.
Oh absolutely. I already have plans to get him a nice code reader since that's one of the things I know he doesn't have. Plus, the house we bought a few years ago came with a huge auto garage (it's bigger than my house) that the late owner used to use as his business. Still has the car lift in it and the big ole air compressor. Car lift needs a new brake on it but it otherwise golden. I've told him anytime he needs a covered, clean place to work on his car or anyone else's he is more than welcome to come use my garage.

Just got back from town, bought a little hydraulic jack (2 tons), a new socket set and wrench set, pos and neg wires and alligator clips to make a tester for the fan. I'll look up the fan with the assembly online now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grasshopper77 View Post
While you wait for some assistance, i suggest you checkout the below link to see if your fan is working properly...

Replaced Radiator Fan Assembly - Still no fan movement
Thanks for the link Grasshopper. I will check that out before I start tinkering.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fk5 View Post
+1 with Grasshopper

Some of these problems (even going back to your previous jobs) might just be the fan, the wiring, or the relay(s). Follow the steps to check. You have come this far, the fan is an easy job once it is diagnosed and you have come so far already!

I am a bit concerned with your comments that it overheats fast. I don't think the head gasket is much of a problem on these cars, unless you let them get hot. The iron block/aluminium head combos traditionally don't like that. Don't let it get hot! Shut it down ASAP once the gauge starts moving above halfway.
The fast overheat is a new problem. New as in it just started happening after the water pump installment. Prior to that it had to be going for a while before it began to overheat (20+ miles or so). I would put it in park and turn it off at red lights and had rode in the blazing upper 80's lower 90's degree weather with the heater blasting full bore to keep it from overheating too much. IE: when it started creeping above halfway and before it hit the warning light. Sucked especially since I can't roll my driver's side window down at the moment (one problem at a time though) but, I at least had the sunroof and other three windows to roll down. When I had to replace my radiator before it was because I wasn't expecting it and it had went into the red on the interstate. I honestly would not be surprised if those jerks at the ripoff shop that replaced the radiator and screwed with my heating vents didn't intentionally disconnect something on the radiator cooling fan so that I would have to come back again. I'll find out when I get in there and get the fan off (or when I'm in the process of getting the fan off.)

Thanks to everyone that's chimed in here on this thread. I really do appreciate the help. I've always been a 'tom boy' growing up but Dad wasn't a car guy. (He was a meat cutter and could work wonders in that area. LOL.) He was not one to be able to teach his kids how to work on cars. I have no idea how my brothers learned. So I'm enjoying getting to learn how to take care of some of these things for myself and knowing/finding out when a job is too big for me and I have to pull in backup.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 25 Aug 2017, 06:13 pm
rckstein's Avatar
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,518
Default Re: Overheating Issues

In case you don't have it, you'll certainly need it, you can get a copy of the Service Manual:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9av5weyw5j...anual.pdf?dl=0

Parts Catalog:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y9kie6gh30...talog.pdf?dl=0

And Owner's Manual from my Dropbox links:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ku23o6smdh...anual.pdf?dl=0
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Old 26 Aug 2017, 01:50 am
Sinbad's Avatar
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Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 535
Default Re: Overheating Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by 911Gal View Post
Hey guys and gals! It's been a while since I've been on here but I guess that's kind of a good thing that Ye Olde Cruiser has been working well enough for so long, right?

Well I have a doozy of an issue going on right now. I'll give you the full scoop on this from the start to now.

Had a total radiator failure back about a year ago and had it towed into the shop from the interstate to get it replaced. The shady ass shop that did it didn't bleed or burp it properly so it worked a little while then started having issues again. That wasn't all they did either. They went out of business soon after I had mine worked on that summer. (apparently from ripping people off)

So wintertime rolls around and I can feel heat radiating from the vents but no hot air blowing. Not only that but it has started to overheat when driving again.

I take it to a different place who is wonderful and trustworthy and told them all that happened and sure enough the other place had intentionally went in and disconnected something (I can't remember what it was that they told me) to prevent it from blowing hot air. They didn't come right out and say the words that the other place had screwed me but upon further questioning they said that it couldn't have happened accidently or have just happened on it's own. Yeah... Also they had to replace the mount and a wire under the filler valve (tube the cap is on, sorry, I'm REALLY bad at knowing the names of the parts and I don't claim to be any kind of mechanic at all). Oh and also I discovered after hitting a cocker spaniel sized possum on the way home from work one early morning where it busted part of my front bumper off and took the plastic screen off the front that the place that replaced my radiator had also not remounted the little power steering (? I think that's what it is) radiator thing that sits in front of and beneath the radiator. It was only fastened on one side and the other side was hanging down.

So it runs good all winter then this spring it starts overheating again. I change the thermostat (yay! learning to work on it myself!) and discover that the people that changed my radiator out the first time ALSO didn't put a gasket on it, instead there was blue goop that they used that did not seal it at ALL.

Get that changed out and fast forward a few months and lo and behold overheating AGAIN.

At first it only does it when the car is idling at a light on the road. Doesn't do it when idling in park (of course it could have but I never sat with it running for an hour to test).

I burp it again and there's a small drippage coming from somewhere but I can't figure out where. After I burp it it runs good for about a week or two. Eventually gets to where I'm burping every day to every other day.

Then I notice a little trail of fluid on the ground when I pull out of work one morning that follows me. Water pump I figure. I get it home, park it, and have a mechanic friend come down to look at it. Turn it on and water is pouring out from underneath. Yep, bad water pump.

So it takes about 2 weeks (having to source out and find the right screw at the dealership and then having to borrow the right harmonic balancer installer from same dealership). We put on a new water pump and change the timing belt. Put it back together and it should be running, right?

Well no. It's still overheating. Overheating fast. I burped it again and I'm gonna use the bleeder valve but I also noticed that the fan is not turning at all now. FML. *head hung in defeat*

So here is where I'm at.

I know I need to check the fan and roughly how to get it off but I'm not sure what else I need to check (or how) when it comes to the plugs and wires and stuff.

I am seriously ready to cry. My lil Cruiser has been so good to me for so long and gotten me through the worst weather imaginable to and from work (I'm 911, we don't get to call out of work when the roads are bad in the winter) and has made 2 trips back and forth from Kentucky to New York. It's a 2006 Touring Edition (non-turbo) and has over 150,000 miles on it. So I either have to get this issue fixed or (worst case scenario) have to just get another car.

How expensive of a fix am I looking at here and is it worth it to continue to triage my Cruiser? I really love my little car and I don't want to get rid of it. If it can be salvaged even if only for a few more years that would be best financially. I'd rather paid a few hundred to fix than a few thousand to get a new car.

If it's just this fan or connectors I might be able to do it myself (I hate to ask the mechanic friend to do it since he just finished that 2 week job and did all that for free). It would work out better financially because I can't really afford to have someone fix it or the tow it would require to get it there right now after spending so much over the last two weeks on parts and tools. (I drove about a quarter mile or less yesterday down the road to test it after burping it and it started overheating bad. Driving to the shop is not an option.)

Any guidance or advice would be greatly appreciated for this novice wrench tinkerer who doesn't know the technical terms for things (LOL, Dohickey and whatsit are common in my vocabulary. I can see it and understand what it is but then when trying to recall the technical name it escapes me most times.)

I've been watching a lot of videos on the subject so I think I need to take the fan out, get alligator clips to test the fan itself, and I think there's two connectors I need to check?

There's a junk yard down the road a bit I might be able to get parts from or at worst can order them from RocAuto if the parts stores in town don't have them. I just REALLY need to get my Cruiser up and running again.

(EDIT TO ADD ps. I have checked the oil and it's not milky, also not blowing white smoke from the exhaust. There is an oil leak that I will eventually have to address and likely have to get a new head gasket considering the age and miles on it but it doesn't appear that there's coolant leaking or mixing in. I've started to use just plain water in it for the moment since it's still nice hot summer temperatures right now. Mechanic friend put in proper coolant when changing out the water pump though. Also I wonder if there could be a clog in the reservoir since prior to the water pump change it didn't appear to be cycling at all. It still had the colored coolant in it even though when I was topping up the radiator I was using straight water. If so could that be part of the overheating issues?

You would have had to take the radiator out to do the timing belt and water pump.
Was it flushed out before putting it back?
If not, take it out again and do it. You can do it in situ but out is better because it often helps to turn the rad through 90 degrees a few times during the flush.

Replace the main hoses if not done already - if they've been cooked they could be collapsing internally without looking as if they are outwardly.

Make sure that the heater cock is opening properly and water can flow through the heater OK (flush it)

Fan, other people have covered more than adequately.

Check the temperature *properly* (open rad with a thermometer) - gauges are very on / off and not accurate. If it overheats, it will boil and bubble like a kettle and make slamming / banging noises from the filler reservoir - if it's not doing that, it's not overheating whatever the gauge says. If it does overheat it can happen very quickly in my experience - a few minutes in traffic without the low fan and you're cooking.
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Old 26 Aug 2017, 02:05 am
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Posts: 535
Default Re: Overheating Issues

Just a further thought - what was the water pump impeller like when you replaced it? If is was broken up there is a likelihood that lumps of it have been pumped around the system - hopefully they will be in the radiator or the heater matrix and easily flushed, rather having lodged themselves in the block. I would back flush the block while I had the radiator out - just in case.

* by the block, I mean the engine ;-)
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