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2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

 
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 02:32 pm
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Default 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

I have read on some posts about using the Relay (on firewall) to direct test the fuel pump by jumping 30 (verified hot) to 87 at the relay socket.

I performed this and the first time a light spark occured but if the pump turned I did not catch it. There is still 12v at 30 and a tried a few more times but nothing (no pump sound) including no spark. I still have 12v at 30.

I went ahead and using an analog VOM on 0 to 100 ohm scale get 2.5 to 3 ohms between battery negative terminal and 87 on the relay socket.

This tells me that there is some kind of complete circuit (2.5-3 ohms) between 87 and the chassis.

Is there a resistance value I should be reading that can indicate that at least the circuit from 87 on relay socket to chassis has a good ground and within the same reading indicate that pump "coil" still has the expected resistance?

Also, other than the harness and the fuel pump are there any other components in series between the relay 87 terminal and chassis?

As everyone tries to avoid when dealing with the fuel system I also do not want to drop the tank until I can establish that indeed the problem is in the fuel pump assy.

BTW the car has 197,000 miles and has been maintained. The car ran just fine (no hesitations etc) last time used. Then next time went to start .. the engine just turned over. No indication of combustion.

There is spark and I can get engine to run a bit with starting fluid although not like it would with fuel.

Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 02:43 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

i would recommend whacking the tank with a bat or something similar immediately after someone turns the key to the run position.

FWIW dropping the tank on this car is very easy compared to other cars. the fuel line even disconnects easily by squeezing a small clip with your fingers.
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 03:06 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

here's more info regarding your actual question about resistance. the test is for the wiring, not the pump
Capture.jpg
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Last edited by rob302; 23 Dec 2017 at 03:33 pm.
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 03:50 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

Thanks for the info rob302 !

I'm with you on the caveman method !

I did resort to my #1 tool (the rubber mallet) at first (while on ground) but now that I have the car on jacks I will give it another try.

I did one more thing before my first post and that was to check the voltage between 85 and 86 on the relay socket and this I find unusual.

When I probed 85 and 86 with key off there was no voltage (which I assume there should not be) then when I cycled to "run" the voltage went to 12v (+/_) for ~ 3 secs then dropped back to 0V for about 3 secs then back to 12V and stays there as long as in "run".

But when I turned the key off completely (and even pulled the key out) the voltage between 85 and 86 remained at 12V. This is repeatable and got same on both digital and analog VOMs.

I had the key off and out for 5 mins and the voltage (12V) remained.
The voltage will drop to 0V when you just advance the key towards ACC. Does not even need to go fully into ACC just as soon as the key is advanced from OFF towards ACC.

I am assuming that voltage should be cut between 85 and 86 when key is off?

And if so did my Fuel Pump run until it ran no more after the last time the car was parked?
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 04:32 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

maybe the voltage you see is coming from an internal capacitor or something that would easily/quickly get discharged by the actual pump. i would ASSume the battery would go dead every time you mess with the car if what you are saying is an actual problem. for me most anomalies i notice like you are describing are either the result of me doing something wrong(measuring 87 and 30 by mistake for example), or just simply overthinking something.

perhaps try it with a test light to verify it stays lit and is not just residual voltage. i assume the bulb will fade out rather quickly and you will no longer measure 12v between 85 and 86



just FYI.. my pump died around 220k miles. beating the tank got me another couple days
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 05:20 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

On 2006 PT Cruisers the fuel pump control is done through the TIPM. The TIPM receives an input signal from the PCM. Once the TIPM receives the signal, it will output a 12 volt supply to the fuel pump module turning the pump on.

Please verify you have the TIPM in your Pt Cruiser. It should be behind the battery under the hood.
2006 IntegratedPowerModule.jpg

If you do have the TIPM on this thread one of our members bypassed the TIPM and applied 12 volts to the fuel pump to verify it was good. Had to repair the TIPM.
Fuel pump relay
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 06:44 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

ptcruisersteve - Thanks and yes I do have a TIPM.

In the link you sent it was stated the fuel pump was wired direct ??

"but I got the car to turn on, I supply direct power to the fuel pump
and drove it around the block the problem is inside the fuse box
TOTALLY INTEGRATED POWER MODULE or TIPM"


Where was that 12v applied to perform this ?

Thanks
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 07:38 pm
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

Quote:
Originally Posted by betterred View Post
ptcruisersteve - Thanks and yes I do have a TIPM.

In the link you sent it was stated the fuel pump was wired direct ??

"but I got the car to turn on, I supply direct power to the fuel pump
and drove it around the block the problem is inside the fuse box
TOTALLY INTEGRATED POWER MODULE or TIPM"


Where was that 12v applied to perform this ?

Thanks
You should get the 2006 factory service manual.

On page 2427 on the 2006 service manual it shows a wiring diagram of the TIPM with dark brown with orange wire coming out of pin 11 C7 for the fuel pump control output.

You can access the wiring from underneath the vehicle, where the harness goes in above the fuel tank. You want to see 12 volts on the dark green/white wire while trying to start.

Page 2691 shows a C110 connector in the underbody that shows the wire going to the fuel pump. The service manual says the location of the C110 connector should be in the lower right side of the engine compartment with dark green/ white wire in cavity #3 on the C110 connector.
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Last edited by ptcruisersteve; 23 Dec 2017 at 07:48 pm.
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Old 24 Dec 2017, 01:57 am
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

Thanks but the wire colors threw me off which gave me the impression I was at the wrong connectors to begin with:

On page 2427 on the 2006 service manual it shows a wiring diagram of the TIPM with dark brown with orange wire coming out of pin 11 C7 for the fuel pump control output.

You can access the wiring from underneath the vehicle, where the harness goes in above the fuel tank. You want to see 12 volts on the dark green/white wire while trying to start.

Page 2691 shows a C110 connector in the underbody that shows the wire going to the fuel pump. The service manual says the location of the C110 connector should be in the lower right side of the engine compartment with dark green/ white wire in cavity #3 on the C110 connector.


Instead ... I have Dark Blue / Orange that remain those colors from the TIPM through connector C110 through C304 (at the front right corner of fuel tank). I was able to establish 12V at C304 between CAV 1 (black) and Cav 4 (which are Dark Blue / Orange vs Green / White as noted in manual).

Now that I verified power to Fuel Pump (at least through C304) there is still no sound of any pump operating. Guess I do need to drop tank after all ugh!
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Old 24 Dec 2017, 07:07 am
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Default Re: 2006 (2.4 non turbo) Fuel Pump Resistance

Since you say there's no sign of combustion, I'd suggest you check your timing belt. With that many miles an no maintenance on it, I'll bet it's broken or the teeth have stripped off around the crank gear.
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