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No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

 
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Old 27 Oct 2018, 06:17 am
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Default No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

I noticed that neither of our low beams work the other night. Fuses #19 and #20 check out and I can't find any other broken fuses. @reh8388 et al's valuable info on troubleshooting the multifunction switch unit revealed nothing immediately broken, worn, melted, loose, stuck, missing or burnt so I'm wondering where to look next. I genuinely doubt that both bulbs will have burnt out at the same time.

Oddly, our high beam setting doesn't illuminate the LED in the dash any more which is weird. I'm struggling with the service manual to figure out how this could even be a thing.

Has anybody experienced similar issues (that search has maybe not dragged up for me) or can see how this might occur? I'm tempted to throw a new multifunction at it anyway, however given the condition the internals were in (I gave them a clean as a matter of course) I am 90% sure that this isn't at fault, but willing to be convinced based on other's experience.

I hate to have to drive around at night with sidelights or high beams as our only options....
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Old 27 Oct 2018, 07:10 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Check for 12 volt at the fuse.
Surely you have checked the bulb, turn the light on and check for 12 volts at the light socket to a good ground or to the battery ground. Check for continuity on the ground pin at the light socket.
I did find bad grounds on one of my PTs.
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Old 27 Oct 2018, 11:03 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

try fiddling with the grey connector next to the data port. this one: can't see the road!

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Old 27 Oct 2018, 11:39 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Will do, thanks! Checking at the fuses was the next step in my plan also. That grey connector looks like a disaster waiting to happen. I hope I don't need to monkey with that, however it may explain why we got our PT with fogs non-functional (despite being factory) and a weird switch with a fog indicator had been added with no wires going anywhere....maybe a hastily half-reversed mod or "fix" of some kind....

After a drive today, the main beam light illuminated on the dash (with main beams on) so I think it might be the cold solder joints on the cheap LEDs that is the culprit there. Best not conflating the issue with that and trying to figure out how they even *could* interact. Still, worth noting until I can reflow those joints....

Yes, it's very weird. Everything works fine, sidelights, main beams, indicators, rears, brakes. Just no low beams. I might add that our reverse light has been on the dick since summer which I put down to the switch in the gear housing. I doubt these are related issues, however I do seem to be collecting them quicker than I can get around to fixing them....

I'm hoping to get through this winter unscathed, but a lack of low beams is making that unlikely. It can't go out like that with our long dark winters. I might be snagging a 300C CRD in Jan and using that opportunity to convert the PT into a 2-seat 3-dr mini van. Got to survive winter first....
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2001 2.0l PT Cruiser Touring Edition
Mods: New gear knob, blue LED re-lighting, token chrome bits.
215'000km (55.9% distance to the moon, 71.7% of a second at light speed, Usain Bolt running for 200 days)

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use" - Søren Kierkegaard
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence" - Christopher Hitchens
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Old 27 Oct 2018, 12:08 pm
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Non working fogs were a problem usually associated with the Multi Function Switch. Fuses or bulbs pulled to eliminate problem sometimes happened. Light would come on when no one was around, even at night or parked and drain battery.
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65 Dodge Coronet 6 cyl 2dr Post
66 Ply Satellite with 273 engine swap to 69 340 4spd
70 340 4spd Dart Swinger "Those were the days my friend"
73 Charger SE
Had a few Vetts on the way 69, 85
Several Neons some flips
01 Sebring flip
Cruiser's 01, 220K Gone to a new home
Cruiser 03 133K Gone to a new home
Cruiser 06 110K Project Gone to new Home
Cruiser 05 Ltd 120,809 bought with broken belt Oct2015
May 16 Resurrected to once again roam the streets.

20 Miles South Of Pittsburgh
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Old 27 Oct 2018, 01:47 pm
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Sometimes one of the low beams burns out and the driver is not aware of it and when the other one goes out they think both went out at the same time. Might want to check the bulbs and sockets if you are getting 12 volts to the bulbs.
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Old 28 Oct 2018, 02:47 am
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Wink Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Both bulbs were functioning earlier in the week. I recall seeing them working. It would have to be a huge coincidence. I'll check them though.
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2001 2.0l PT Cruiser Touring Edition
Mods: New gear knob, blue LED re-lighting, token chrome bits.
215'000km (55.9% distance to the moon, 71.7% of a second at light speed, Usain Bolt running for 200 days)

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use" - Søren Kierkegaard
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence" - Christopher Hitchens
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Old 28 Oct 2018, 06:54 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

The multi-function switch receives power from (interior) fuse #1. The MFS routes this power to the low beam circuit or the high beam circuit as selected.

When the high beams are switched on, a relay mounted at the bottom of the interior fuse block is activated.
This relay switches a direct power feed from (interior) fuse #1; the power feed that normally goes to the fog light circuit (prior to fuse #8), is switched to feed the low beam bulbs. This circuit does not pass through the MFS.

All four headlight bulbs should be on when high beams are selected.
If the low beams do remain on with the high beam bulbs, you know the bulbs, connector and fuses are good and can focus on the MFS.

If they do not light up with the high beams, the multi-function switch maybe OK and the problem is further along the system.
Sorry to say it is most likely the big connector under the dash, as previously said.

Broken wiring, bad fuses, bad bulbs or burnt connector are the likely problems.
High and low beam bulbs grounds are spliced together on each side. You have high beams. The grounds are probably good
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Old 28 Oct 2018, 09:38 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

Thanks man, always good seeing you around too!

I've been really limited in how much fault-finding I can do thanks to us just having moved house, so my multimeter is stored in a box somewhere. No checking voltages until I unearth that one....!

The low beams aren't active when the high beams are on, so there's a useful clue. The big connector looks okay on minimal inspection. No shmoo or brown stains from crisped electrics. A wiggle and a poke didn't reveal an intermittent open circuit or any crackling.

My interpretation of the service manual pretty much describes everything the same as yourself, Sanatanadharma. I'm glad that it isn't an earthing issue as I have a personal hatred of chasing ghosts with those. I'll bite the bullet I think, and get under the arches to physically inspect the bulbs. If it's something as simple as two bulbs blown in a short period of time, I can't help but be concerned as to *why* that might be. It's unlikely, but let's see what we can find.

Meanwhile, I'm going to do a little reading on how to remove the dash around the connector. I suspect that might start with the centre console outwards, but we'll see. Photos will be forthcoming if there is anything useful to discern, but it all looks clean from the standpoint of condition. Lots of dust, fluff and the usual gunk though. Ugh.
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2001 2.0l PT Cruiser Touring Edition
Mods: New gear knob, blue LED re-lighting, token chrome bits.
215'000km (55.9% distance to the moon, 71.7% of a second at light speed, Usain Bolt running for 200 days)

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use" - Søren Kierkegaard
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence" - Christopher Hitchens
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Old 28 Oct 2018, 10:30 am
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Default Re: No low beam, strange high beam, multifunction okay?

The dash panel in front of the driver's knees opens by pulling out at the top (toward rear of car). There are clips that snap into receivers.
The panel swings down and is hinged at the bottom and can be completely removed; easy to see and do.

Removing the panel reveals two (3?) screws holding the outer trim plastic. Remove them and work that plastic piece free. It is also held by spring clips and has locator pegs on the back. The upper outside corner is tabbed under the dash bezel; the outer edge caught under the door rubber seal.

With these two plastic pieces off, you have about the most access to the connector that is possible without major disassembly, like heater ducts.
I do not recall needing to remove the top dash cover and dash bezel, but maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prostheta View Post
...Meanwhile, I'm going to do a little reading on how to remove the dash around the connector. I suspect that might start with the centre console outwards, but we'll see. Photos will be forthcoming if there is anything useful to discern, but it all looks clean from the standpoint of condition. Lots of dust, fluff and the usual gunk though. Ugh.
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