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Cost Efficient Mod's That Won't Void Warrenty

 
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Old 21 Feb 2003, 02:43 am
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Location: San Francisco, California, USA.
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Default Cost Efficient Mod's That Won't Void Warrenty

Hey everyone,

I'm sure glad I found this discussion forum, a lot of good ideas and good people. I have been pondering the question, how can I improve the performance of the PT Turbo without drasticly changing parts or voiding the warrenty? Well the PT Turbo is as good as it gets, but I have always felt that a little tweaking hear a little adjustment there an presto chango your engine is running better.

1st thing I want to concetrate on is improving the air intake system and cooling charecteristics of the engine. I have read that turbos are notorious for generating heat, and I have noticed that the Intake Manifold and Carb gets really hot because of this. Just drive around for 10 miles, stop, pop open the hood and put your hand on the manifold. Where it should just be warm to the touch, it is actually burning hot. As a result hot engine air creates an environment for poor combustion.
My first thought was to vent the hot air out through induction and ram cold air into the air filter. I'm not interested in altering my PT's apperence so a Good Hood or Cal-Hood is out of the question. What I want to do is modify what is already in place, re-engineer it for higher performance.
Venting hot air out is easy, just remove the wheather strip at the back of the engine compartment, presto chango you now have an induction hood. There is enough air pressure at the base of the windsheild to force air into that little crack where the stripping used to be. I have been driving around this way for two days and every time I check the temp. of the Manifold and Carburetor it is actually cool to touch, unless I am just doing city driving. then temp. is higher.
Ramming cold air into the air intake is easy too. Chrysler in their infinite wisdom has designed a simple but easily overlooked way of getting cold air to the intake. There is a small port just behind the driver side fog light, this path leads to the air intake. I have been trying to come up with a simple way of scooping undercarriage air into this port to increase the air flow. If anyone knows of a cheap part nuumber that could do the job please let me know. Otherwise I will post again once I construct the piece. And if anyone else has a cheap idea of modifying and improving engine performance please share it.

Here are some links to som interesting info

http://www.minimania.com/MM/Inductio...sters_1289.htm
http://www.ptdoityourself.com

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Old 21 Feb 2003, 05:59 am
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Moore, Ok.
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Good ideas. Have to call you Dr. GT Strangelove. hehee
The GT has a lot more intake plumbing than most cars. I was thinking of wrapping the tube going from the turbo (behind the engine) to the intercooler (in front of the radiator) with a foil heat shield. Same with the tube going from the filter box to the back of the engine. When all that tubing gets hot it must heat the air inside it.

Maybe removing that wheather strip is a better way to go or even a combo of the two.

The home improvment store may be the place to look for your air scoop parts.
flexable plastic yard drainage pipe and Y or T connector. Not sure if it will work. Just an idea.

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Old 21 Feb 2003, 04:04 pm
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Hey Chasgood,
Finaly someone gets my [handle] Kubrik was a great man. bless his soul. Anyways your idea about wrapping the tubbing from turbo to intercooler is a great one. I was wondering where you got the foil heat shield. I have also seen, at the hardware store this foil wrap used for insulating water heaters. It has this insulating material sandwiched between two sheets of foil, about 1/4 inch thick.
Your right about needing to do something about the turbo, it seems so close to the carb and manifold and the amount of heat it must be generating must be incredible. I see that DC has put some shielding to seperate the turbo from the engine. What about another air duct coming from the port on the right. it could be directed towords the turbine side of the Turbo? I plan on getting a remote temperture guage soon so I can verify the temperature changes going on.

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Old 21 Feb 2003, 04:32 pm
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DrSL

I am very interested in your experiments and look forward to the temperature measurements you can document.

About the water heater sheild though. Water heaters are only in the 100-140 degree range, so if it has some high temp plastic component, it may not be suitable for under the hood. I am not a mechanic, but I thought that there were products like wide insulating tapes that were specifically made to wrap exhaust headers and protect the engine bay from excessive heat of souped up motors. You might want to check JC Whitney or Pep Boys or a local speed shop.

Tell us more about the removal of the weatherstripping. Is it damaged once removed (could it be replaced if necessary)? Have you inquired on DC as to why it is in place? I wondered if it prevents excessive water from running into the engine bay.





Karl <img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>
2003 PT Cruiser GT
Steel Blue w/AutoStick
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Old 22 Feb 2003, 01:45 am
2sb 2sb is offline
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Carefully reconsider wrapping the duct from the turbo to the cooler. The air inside the duct has been heated by the turbo and that's why it's going to the intercooler. You'll probably be trapping heat inside the duct.
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Old 22 Feb 2003, 02:46 am
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Good point 2sb,

Maybe shielding the tube from the turbo to the intercooler would be better instead of insulating it. Then ambient air rushing from the undercarriage can help cool the tube. Hey chasgood maybe it would be better to insulate the tube running from the intercooler to the charburetor.
About taking the weather strip off, yes if you wash your car, or drive in the rain than you have a very good chance of getting water in the engine bay. Fortunatly for us California has seen bright sunny days. Best regards to those in the east coast. But removing the weather stip does not ruin anything, it just slides right off. In fact I just put the thing on when I needed to wash the car the other day. Like wise for rainy days. But you can really tell the difference heat wise, especially when you do a lot of highway driving. Then when you come to a stop, because hot air rises to the highest point in the engine bay, you can see the heat rising up where the hood meets the windshield, You know all wavy and shimmery.
I have gone to the hardware store though and got a bunch of goodies. I got some materials to 1. make an air filter for the induction heat vent. and 2. material for constructing a scoop for the undercarriage air scoop. Have'nt found a cheap temp. guage yet. But I know there is a $30 one out there, I just can't remember where I saw it. Has anyone seen a cheap temp. guage with remote sensor around?

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Old 22 Feb 2003, 04:22 am
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Saturday I plan on having a close look under the hood. Main thing is looking at taking the silencer out. Already have a K&N filter on. Won't pull it til next gas fill. Will look closer at the the air plumbing above and behind the fog light.
On second thought wraping the tube from the intercooler to the turbo isn't a good idea. Shielding is.
Doing a mpg test this tank. I am turning the traction control off every time I start the car. Hard to tell for sure but it may have more pep off the line. Will know tuesday or wednesday if it effects mpg. Something to do. hehee

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Old 25 Feb 2003, 04:10 am
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Something to do is right, I'm just having fun trying to understand the inner workings of my PT Turbo. For one it looks like there is not a lot of info on this subject and 2. there are no aftermarket mods to buy so for the mean time why don't we make our own.

OK I got my temp./ humidity gauge (Target $14). As stated before I want to get a better idea of the temperture of the air going through the air intake system and how the turbocharger effects the ambient air inside the engine bay. And my results are: it gets hot...<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle> Big shock there. 160 degrees + when at a stop light. My temp gauge is limited to 160, but I would guess by the rate the temp increassed it had a while before stopping.

Test #1
returned air intake system to stock specifications and placed the temp. sensor in the air box below the stock filter. I ran the engine for 10 miles to get it up to normal running temp.
PT Turbo Stock Air Intake:
Outside Temp: 48 f
Air Box: 52 f
Humidity: 36%

Test #2
Modified fender well intake, K&N drop in filter, Weatherstrip removal (Induction Vent)
PT Turbo Modified Air Intake:
Outside Temp: 49 f
Air Box: 51 f
Humidity: 36%

I ran this test twice at a average speed of 65 mph for ten miles. Than allowing the temp. in the air box to reach 80 degrees f due to the heat that built up in the engine bay approx. 5 minutes. In Test #1 it took 8 miles for the temp which decreased slowly and didn't cool until I stopped where the temp. In the air box was 52f . With the modifications in Test #2 the temp. decreased after the first mile and remained a steady 51 F.

Result: The modified air box cooled down faster and remained 2 degrees f above the outside temperature.

Test #3
I moved the temp. gauge sensor on the intake manifold just behind the 2.4 Liter raised letters and returned the air intake system to stock specs. Since this is the last point in which the air passes before combustion I thought this would be a good place to measure, also the turbo is placed behind this so I felt that if ambient heat from the turbo was going to effect anything it would be here.
PT Turbo Stock Intake:
Outside Air: 48 f
Intake Manifold: 66 f
Humidity 39%

Test #4
Pt Turbo Modified air intake: Same as above (Test #2)
Outside Air: 48 f
Intake Manifold: 61 f
Humidity: 38%

Once again I ran these tests twice average speed 65 mph for 10 miles allowing the temperature in the engine bay to reach 160 degrees f. Due to the limit of the temp. gauge I began each test at 160 f, but I am sure that the ambient air in the engine bay was much higher. The stock set up retained the heat longer and just barely reached 66 f after 9 miles. With the modified set up the Intake Manifold cooled down quickly within 2 miles and remained at 61 f

Result: The modified set up helped vent out the hot 160 +, allowing cold air into the intake during start up and the absence of the weatherstripping inducted cool air into the engine bay alowing the intake manifold to cool to a running temperature of 61 f . The modified set up ran 13 degrees f above outside air.

Conclussion: What does this all mean? Who knows where this is going right, but what the hay it sure is interesting to me<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

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Old 25 Feb 2003, 05:56 am
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We'll have to call you Dr. Stranglove the mad PT GT scientist!<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Cruise on!
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Old 25 Feb 2003, 07:09 am
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Hey Dr,

Great tests. Definitely the doctor is in the house! We are starting to understand the heartbeats of our car thanks to the good dr.

Here are my two cents:

if you test this numbers in a hotter day, you will see the same effect with bigger improvements. I checked the engine temp with an infrared temp gauge and the numbers were horrible!! 225 degrees in the engine itself, when the dash gauge is in the normal position. that is why your gauge maxed out at 160 degrees. Normal fuel injected, modern, engines operate at this high temperatures for emission control.

here is some more food for thought.

As per "Compact Cars" Turbo experts, there is too much rubber in the intake tubing of our cars. The rubber expands lowering the final boost to the manifold. they call this the Balloon effect.

If we exchange those parts from the turbo to the intake manifold thru the intercooler with metal or PVC tubes it will have a constant pressure and will permit us to modify up to 18lbs of pressure.

In other news, yesterday I smoked two Mitsu Eclipses (road Racing, don't tell anyone please...) with just the modified intake box. those guys were so pissed to see my GT logo in front of them, there is only one GT in this island, guess who is the owner of it? hehehe. one of the cars had like $ 10,000 in carbon fiber and that huge spoiler that looks like it is ready for take off! they think that those mods will increase performance, that car was lowered so much that it hit the floor and sparks flew. But my "stock" PT flew by him... I have never seen a guy hit the steering wheel so hard in frustration...

O well, I will remove the weather strip today and try it in 88+ ambient temperature.

Thank you Dr.


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